6 Mile Run Conditions

[gpTron]

I just started riding this year. Before I signed up here I went to 6 Mile last St. Patrick's day. No clue to the conditions or the trail system in general, but it was 70 degrees; I assumed everything would be dry. I rode in to a muddy park. I walked around a lot of sloppiness because I carry my bike in the trunk of my vehicle. Some dirt is ok, but a bike covered in mud? No thanks. After walking around my 3rd mud pit I said "this sucks" and went back. I wasn't even out 15 mins. Then I signed up here a week or 2 later and felt awful when I saw just how horrible a deed I'd committed. But the point is is that I had no prior knowledge of the conditions and wasn't even aware mud riding was bad. I thought it was part of the experience (don't kill me).

All the big mountain biking apps like Strava needs some sort of trail condition alert feature if they don't already have it. The problem is these people riding on muddy days probably don't post here which means they don't know the conditions and are ignorant to how these trails dry out. If I'm some ignorant biker bro waking up on a sunny 60 degree day in Feb I'm assuming every park in the state is going to be dry and perfect. You gear up, you make the drive only to find it's muddy. But you think "well, I made the trip, might as well ride anyway even if this place appears to be super muddy and even closed". It seems from everyone's interactions with these types that most don't care. But I also think it's because they've already committed to the ride. If they find out some other way BEFORE they leave their house all geared up and hyped that the park is closed and unridable, they might find another option. These types love their Stravas so it might be the only way to inform these people. Some sort of alert system when a trail is officially closed. I need to check out the app more in depth and see if they take feature requests.

Again, I'm new. I don't have the experience biking or dealing with these types like most of you do so I could be way off base, but because I am new I also knew what it was like to be ignorant to the community until I signed up here.

 

[jklett]

I can give a couple hours here and there but besides telling people that the closed signs mean closed, what can we do? If these asshats have no problem going around the chains and telling the park superintendent off, what do you think they'll do when we tell them no? Don't get me wrong, I'll still do it but I don't have high hopes that it'll make any difference.

 

[Juggernaut]

I just want to remind everyone again, not everyone in the 6mile lots are out on the trails. Many people (ok me) park there and ride the canal or road on sloppy days (months).

 

[pygmypony]

So I was out working on a new section today, but before I got out there I stopped at the canal road lot.
The lot was basically full of cars with bike racks.
The park has revised the signage so in now says “too muddy CLOSED”.

I watched a few people ride around the sign and another group arrive back with their bikes slathered in mud

On the 27 side I saw no riders, but these pics show what looks like the aftermath of a CX race

Not View attachment 119883View attachment 119884impressed.

yeesh...

 

[Patrick]

On-site Policing is not a volunteer activity.
All you need is one roided up rider and it won't turn out well.
Not to mention group actions during confrontation.

Start giving out tickets, and the word will spread.
They can sit right after the first couple turns from the lot, and send people back out across the grass with a nice summons.
Of course they won't have ID on them, so it might not have bite, but the word will spread. (i don't carry an ID all the time)

----

Dropping links into someone's strava explaining why they shouldn't ride in the mud seems reasonable.
Putting up a banner on the fence seems reasonable - a little JORBA money is available for signage.
Maybe even info fliers on cars that were observed as mtbrs
-----
Perhaps the sign in Spanish and Tagalog would help?

 

[Ian F]

Unfortunately, I agree - "self policing" has little chance of working because the offenders have no regard for anyone who is not carrying a badge (and probably a gun).

If the trails are closed, could riding be regarded as trespassing? If so, the Township police are missing the chance of some good revenue.

 

[KenS]

We do not intend to ask for self policing, nor is it recommended. We do however have an opportunity to educate our community, particularly new riders who are unaware of the negative impacts of riding during freeze thaw.

The park has asked if JORBA is willing to set up an educational "booth" at the park over the next two weekends. If I can get a tent/table there, do we have folks interested in covering a few hours? Ideally we set up from 9a-3p on Saturday 2/29 and Saturday 3/7. If we have an overwhelming response maybe even set up on Sundays as well.

 

[qclabrat]

We do not intend to ask for self policing, nor is it recommended. We do however have an opportunity to educate our community, particularly new riders who are unaware of the negative impacts of riding during freeze thaw.

The park has asked if JORBA is willing to set up an educational "booth" at the park over the next two weekends. If I can get a tent/table there, do we have folks interested in covering a few hours? Ideally we set up from 9a-3p on Saturday 2/29 and Saturday 3/7. If we have an overwhelming response maybe even set up on Sundays as well.

Where do we sign up?

 

[njmark]

My son has a 10 am basketball game saturday in manville. I can do a few hours after 12pm.

 

[NJ Gator]

Just an idea- what about a pamphlet with directions to Allaire and a trail map? I get it is far but if someone is out and needs to ride it is at least an option versus- sorry you drove here only to find out you really shouldn’t ride here...

 

[NJ Gator]

Also happy to help got see what the b-ball playoff situation is first- should know Thursday

 

[KenS]

Where do we sign up?

Once I confirm some JORBA staff participants I'll post a sign up link. Was looking to gauge interest 1st. Thank you.

 

[Magic]

Idea for under the desk for when things get rowdy.

 

[Juggernaut]

Idea for under the desk for when things get rowdy.

Scatter gun is more appropriate for that application....:/

 

[mtbiker87]

Juggernaut brings up a valid point about trail runners. The " tough mudder",and trail running events are indeed a real issue. Sometimes if not worse than a few rogue mtb'ers, even up here in north. They so severely damage the Creek XC trails during and in prep for the Spartan race, that no one really gives a crap to bother maintaining, or even ridding them, anymore. Now that Waywayanda has similar events, I've seen the damage there in places as well. The folks who do these events seem to feel that because they are stupid enough to pay exorbitant amounts of money to enter these events, they have the right to drop thier litter along the trails as they stomp through the mud.

 

[Fire Lord Jim]

One car in the lot on Monday, didn't look like a cyclist. (Roadies on a porta-john break.}

 

[mtbiker87]

On the flip side though, arnt we our own worse enemies? We raise holy hell about folks tearing up Six Mile in the wet, yet run races in the rain...snow..mud..because why ? We dont want to payback the entry fees? The competitors drove all this way to compete? We cant secure the venue for another date ? Isnt that a bit hypocritical?

And if we do run races in crap weather, where then are competitors supposed to prepare for such conditions if not on the trails themselves ?

Or do racers get a pass, while the rest of the greater MTB public is expected to stay home or ride the roads ?

Now look, I'm not an idiot. Most racers,being enthusiasts,have more respect for the trails than your average user, but shouldn't those folks be setting the example, rather than declaring themselves the exception ?

How can we gain the ear of the general public when outwardly it seems to be a case of do as I say, not as I do ?

 

[stb222]

On the flip side though, arnt we our own worse enemies? We raise holy hell about folks tearing up Six Mile in the wet, yet run races in the rain...snow..mud..because why ? We dont want to payback the entry fees? The competitors drove all this way to compete? We cant secure the venue for another date ? Isnt that a bit hypocritical?

And if we do run races in crap weather, where then are competitors supposed to prepare for such conditions if not on the trails themselves ?

Or do racers get a pass, while the rest of the greater MTB public is expected to stay home or ride the roads ?

Now look, I'm not an idiot. Most racers,being enthusiasts,have more respect for the trails than your average user, but shouldn't those folks be setting the example, rather than declaring themselves the exception ?

How can we gain the ear of the general public when outwardly it seems to be a case of do as I say, not as I do ?

The promoters will always say they have agreements to either build new trails or fix the damage and at a minimum do some level of Tm even if the areas damaged by the race aren’t addressed. Specifically to 6 mile, that agreement is basically solely based on the work Jason does.

Ultimately it is up to the facility to make the call. You do have the fool me once parks that simply didn't know what damage would be caused by the event and/or the TM agreement was never fulfilled and/or they were sold a bad set of goods. Where this has happened the parks do not allow those events anymore. This happened at Mercer when a national cross race destroyed one of the grass fields and it was years until that field was the same. Mercer also cancelled a NICA race the first year of the NJ league and it never returned to that venue.

Having it on private property is one way around this. The first NICA race my son did was in the most horrific conditions I have ever ridden in. Basically, had to tell the kids, we are racing on private property, you should never ride your bike in this conditions otherwise. But what a crap message that is to deliver.

But yes, most promoters are not going to cancel.

OH, and there is this:

 

[mtbiker87]

stb222....you beat me to it, I was just thinking the same thing, and it goes along with the greater point I was trying to make. As long as media, advertising, and competive events glorify, or at least seem accepting, of riding in crap conditions, how can we expect people to not call BS when we tell them not to do it themselves? How many shops have promo material with pics of say.....Brage Vestavik scandi flicking his way down a series of switchbacks ? Kate or Nino standing on a podium speckled with mud ? Gwin killing it in downpour ? Watch a DH race and listen to the announcer go on and on about how if it rains Danny Hart will slay it ? Ect....ect.....ect...If that dont change....and you and I know it won't...not anytime soon....how can you expect Joe Q public not to look at that stuff on the web, or in the shop, and take his new ride out to get it properly dirty ?

 

[rmap01]

One car in the lot on Monday, didn't look like a cyclist. (Roadies on a porta-john break.}View attachment 119983

Does the Park need to provide a reason for the trails being closed? Posting the term "Too Muddy" can make some people think "No it's not" or that the sign was put up days before but the park forgot to take it down thinking how can it be so muddy given how nice the weather has been? Why not just post:
"Trails Closed"
"Absolutely No ? ? !"
[Optional: "Violators will be ticketed"] Just a thought...

Just an idea- what about a pamphlet with directions to Allaire and a trail map? I get it is far but if someone is out and needs to ride it is at least an option versus- sorry you drove here only to find out you really shouldn’t ride here...

While Allaire is usually a very good alternative there are times where (many) trails there should not be ridden. We've been extremely fortunate weatherwise this year but some seem to think Allaire is completely rainproof.