Another Cyclist Murdered

Carson

Sport Bacon
Team MTBNJ Halter's
Where you live can make a difference as well. On my street - which resembles a tightly packed shore town because the houses were originally built for similar reasons - the chances of a missed shot or even over-penetration into a neighbor's house would be extremely high. It would be hard for me to aim in any direction without another house 100' or less away. Especially from my front door.

That said, I have often hypothesized that the reason crime is fairly low in my area is because it's generally blue-collar and you can pretty much assume every house on the street is armed.

Load with birdshot. You likely won't kill anyone or penetrate exterior walls, but you will effectively end the threat.
 

rick81721

Lothar
That's the thing - the home values in my neighborhood are some of the lowest in the area. But around half the residents are retired, so it's pretty much impossible that something can happen on the street without someone noticing.

But I agree with the above comment about guns being related to a sense of control over one's environment when so much of the world feels out of control. My own interest in guns is from a military history and sport perspective than from personal protection concerns.

There is a misconception that most gun owners have guns in fear of home invasion, which is nonsense. I first bought a handgun for target shooting. Then I bought several shotguns and rifles for hunting. I bet that map of gun ownership by state lines up very well with hunters/capita.
 

Ian F

Well-Known Member
There is a misconception that most gun owners have guns in fear of home invasion, which is nonsense. I first bought a handgun for target shooting. Then I bought several shotguns and rifles for hunting. I bet that map of gun ownership by state lines up very well with hunters/capita.
Based on my own experience I don't disagree, but I personally know gun owners who are not hunters or target shooters and their guns were purchased entirely for home protection. Is the trope of the paranoid white guy in his basement hoarding AR-15s over blown by the media? Definitely. But that trope is based in a kernel of truth and cannot be dismissed as "nonsense" just because it doesn't apply to you.
 

rick81721

Lothar
Based on my own experience I don't disagree, but I personally know gun owners who are not hunters or target shooters and their guns were purchased entirely for home protection. Is the trope of the paranoid white guy in his basement hoarding AR-15s over blown by the media? Definitely. But that trope is based in a kernel of truth and cannot be dismissed as "nonsense" just because it doesn't apply to you.

I was referring specifically to home invasion. I know the stats say the majority of gun owners do so for "personal protection" but that is a broad stroke. I was surprised to see that more than 30% of handgun owners carry at least once a month:

https://ajph.aphapublications.org/doi/10.2105/AJPH.2022.307094
 

thegock

Well-Known Member
Don’t forget climate change, it just hasn’t been as obvious.

@JPark left out the obvious false flag operation on 1/6/21
BALI HIGH IMG_20200208_110945-02.jpg
 

serviceguy

Well-Known Member
Making generalizations about the behavior of an entire population, based on your own personal experience is LOL-able.
So is expecting the outcome of your personal experience to be in line with the average outcome of said population. Likely does not equal certain. Not sure what post you were responding to but in general I agree with your comment, just thought I would reverse the logic and see if it worked. I think it does.
 

rick81721

Lothar
Interesting survey results - very large sample size:

"The survey further finds that approximately a third of gun owners (31.1%) have used a firearm to defend themselves or their property, often on more than one occasion, and it estimates that guns are used defensively by firearms owners in approximately 1.67 million incidents per year. Handguns are the most common firearm employed for self-defense (used in 65.9% of defensive incidents), and in most defensive incidents (81.9%) no shot was fired. Approximately a quarter (25.2%) of defensive incidents occurred within the gun owner's home, and approximately half (53.9%) occurred outside their home, but on their property. About one out of ten (9.1%) defensive gun uses occurred in public, and about one out of thirty (3.2%) occurred at work."

https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=4109494
 

JimN

Captain Wildcat
Team MTBNJ Halter's
The survey further finds that approximately a third of gun owners (31.1%) have used a firearm to defend themselves or their property, often on more than one occasion

I have no skin in this game, and I've only been half following this thread, but this doesn't pass the smell test for me. There was previously a graphic showing that some states had like 50% of their people owning guns. This would mean that one in six people in the state used a gun to defend themselves on their property. How many people do you (the royal you) know that have used a gun to defend themselves on their property?
 

rick81721

Lothar
I have no skin in this game, and I've only been half following this thread, but this doesn't pass the smell test for me. There was previously a graphic showing that some states had like 50% of their people owning guns. This would mean that one in six people in the state used a gun to defend themselves on their property. How many people do you (the royal you) know that have used a gun to defend themselves on their property?

Well it's a survey of gun owners conducted by a qualified person. Perhaps they are lying but I don't know why they would. The major point was most defensive uses of guns involve no actual shooting - which is not captured by other "counts". I've lived in very low crime areas most of my life so I personally don't know anyone who has used a gun defensively.
 

JimN

Captain Wildcat
Team MTBNJ Halter's
I've lived in very low crime areas most of my life so I personally don't know anyone who has used a gun defensively.

Same, which is I guess my point. And I know quite a few people with guns, mostly for hunting though, not self defense.

Perhaps they are lying but I don't know why they would.

I'm not suggesting they are lying, but anyone with an agenda has a reason to skew the results of a study. Not saying they did that, and I don't care enough to read the study. It just seems crazy to me, but like you said, we don't really live in high crime areas.
 
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