What new thread is Patrick creating now?

Fundamental issue - less kids riding, and I don’t count those zipping around town on their battery powered mopeds. Most of us came up in the 90’s when the sport started to blow up, most of us are still at it. Most of the people I see on the trails in NJ are “old guys” like me. My son is literally the only kid in his HS that rides, my daughter, forget it. Most 13yr old girls are at Starbucks. The industry knows this, hence the push for ebikes.
 
Norm said:
Ok I deleted the bulk of the message but wanted you to be notified that I replied to you. I am going to ask a series of questions. Also, I am going to say that you have now become the spokesman for the New Jersey EveryMan. Also, I trust that you are trying to help and make it better, so I am not trying to bait you into anything. I legit value your feedback.

1. Do you think the overall site format is less user-friendly today than it was in 2013?
1a. If so, is that because "actual content" doesn't really exist on the site anymore and it's all just buried in the slurry of threads?
2. The succession plan is a problem everywhere. As a pretty active JORBA rep, we have this conversation all the time. Kirt and I are dumping a lot of time & effort into CR/Cromwell. We both know that in 5 years we may both be gone and who is going to pick that up? There is a very real chance it goes back to an eroded set of trails that struggle to be maintained. The same goes for the biking scene. Where is this 20-40 year old demographic that's going to take any of this over? It's a rhetorical question to me.
3. To the point above, we have not seen this 20-40 demographic that you talk about. Like none, zero. Once in a blue moon we get someone in that age group and they disappear in a week.
4. I don't really know what sort of solution one might offer for the Norm/Patrick problem. We're never going to say, "Hey person X, you can't post that much." So it begs the question, who isn't posting? I think Patrick is trying to fill a gap to create content which is going to come from what he knows. So it'll be highly personal. That's natural and begs the question of the new demographic coming in to help that doesn't really exist.
5. I generally dislike the ban option. In the past when I banned someone it was openly stated, and there was a timeline. More often than not they would come back and be fine. I am not aware of non-bots/spammers being blocked. On this note, I actually dislike the ignore user/thread button as it really means that people will not see the content there. That said, I have ignored threads for the reasons you mention. I simply do not care about cars yet it is the most popular thread here, with maybe the exception of beer, which I also ignore. The fact that Cars & Beer were at the top of the list every day for YEARS is what made me a little sad and start to detach. No matter what I do, BEER IS MORE IMPORTANT. I digress. I am joining your rowboat, TBH.
6. I miss Norm's MTBNJ but I also consider that Team MTBNJ's MTBNJ - it feels like the days are past. This is true of both the team and the site. Why is that? IDK. We have a similar disconnect with the team now in that we do not have a central focus to drive us like we used to in the past (races, events, etc).
7. I believe the Hartshorne issue has been resolved, FTR.

I am open to whoever else wants to add feedback. I would love to have more weekly content posts from myself or others. I would love to do a podcast but I cannot drive that. I'd be more than happy to talk on a zoom call for 30 minutes and record it. But who has time for that?

I also wish the content was more-better-biglier. I struggle with this from time to time. But I also know I would need to just add more Norm to the mix and I struggle to commit to that.

I like turtles.
I love lamp.

Please anyone else add feedback. I won't ban you. Unless I don't like you. Then I will.

Just kidding. Maybe.
Click to expand...
100% feel like I am trying to help - hopefully it is taken/comes off that way.

1. Do you think the overall site format is less user-friendly today than it was in 2013?
  • For my use, it is not a "site" or "format" thing that would frustrate me - more content. I am more of a "Type A" type of person, my personality looks for inspiration. The Race Blogs/Training threads from the likes of @Pearl or @Steve Vai were/are pretty awesome and provide an idea/insight to that level/mindset. Not to single anyone else out, but those two were top of mind. @Patrick does a wonderful job keeping the site going on a technology level
2. The succession plan is a problem everywhere. As a pretty active JORBA rep, we have this conversation all the time. Kirt and I are dumping a lot of time & effort into
  • Understood - I think in person events helps a lot here, I know with racing fizzling it gets harder to recruit from in person type events. With the amount of users at the trailhead, there has to be a way to get more users involved - it probably takes money.
3. To the point above, we have not seen this 20-40 demographic that you talk about. Like none, zero. Once in a blue moon we get someone in that age group and they disappear in a week.
  • I used to spend a lot of time at Allaire - five to seven days a week. The 20-40 years old's got the impression the members of this site were "crotchety old men" - maybe I am. My eco-Karen / trail-Karen vibe probably didn't help too much - but I was not alone. I primarily used to work on the trail on rainy days - it was very disheartening to see other members ride on wet/muddy days only to come back on the board and yell at those who did (I am hoping this was just a few of you). I felt like Ralphie in the Christmas Story when he found out his Little Orphan Annie decoder pin just led him to a commercial - but such is life. Skunked Again! This site seemed more "trail-conservative" where the Facebook groups seem more like the dark-web. We push rules and order (well some of us), FB pushed "Chaos" - build jumps, ride in the rain, run ebikes, build fires (damn that all sounds fun!). Even after all of this - the trails are still there.
4. I don't really know what sort of solution one might offer for the Norm/Patrick problem. We're never going to say, "Hey person X, you can't post that much." So it begs the question, who isn't posting? I think Patrick is trying to fill a gap to create content which is going to come from what he knows. So it'll be highly personal. That's natural and begs the question of the new demographic coming in to help that doesn't really exist.
  • Two issues here - it's a lot of non-cycling content on a cycling site - there are better places for that, so it becomes a giant text/email thread amongst friends, this polarizes new uses (in general, of course there are exceptions). Two, this site is heavily pushing JORBA and he is "The Face of the Site" as noted above. When he posts that he is going to run motorized equipment in the water at six mile to build a bridge I loose both respect for this site as well as JORBA as that is illegal and pretty stupid as noted previously in the six mile thread.
5. I generally dislike the ban option. In the past when I banned someone it was openly stated, and there was a timeline. More often than not they would come back and be fine. I am not aware of non-bots/spammers being blocked. On this note, I actually dislike the ignore user/thread button as it really means that people will not see the content there. That said, I have ignored threads for the reasons you mention. I simply do not care about cars yet it is the most popular thread here, with maybe the exception of beer, which I also ignore. The fact that Cars & Beer were at the top of the list every day for YEARS is what made me a little sad and start to detach. No matter what I do, BEER IS MORE IMPORTANT. I digress. I am joining your rowboat, TBH.
  • Beer and cars are easy things for people who rarely ride bikes to talk about. They both keep me off the bike, I am trying to change that (again). The top/recent posts feature is kind of an issue, as things slow sometimes I just look there, if I am not interested in something there I log off. It is probably too late in the game to remove that, as some users may not look at all if it is gone, but I could be wrong.
6. I miss Norm's MTBNJ but I also consider that Team MTBNJ's MTBNJ - it feels like the days are past. This is true of both the team and the site. Why is that? IDK. We have a similar disconnect with the team now in that we do not have a central focus to drive us like we used to in the past (races, events, etc).
  • In my opinion this is a succession issue. I think the same can be said for JORBA and some of the parks. I get it that there are more active managers than others, and the squeaky wheel gets the grease but it is hard to give money to JORBA if you do not travel to ride and stay at a local park that does not receive a lot of love. Is there a way to vote park managers in? If you have done maintenance at the park in the last two years you get a vote? I get it JORBA does a lot of other stuff - but this can be hard to swallow if you live at a unloved park. I used to be very active in this, but my mouth was soured years ago when I tried to secure a grant for an un-named park, my requests went on deaf ears until I was finally told "we have tried those in the past but they don't work" - well I had the funds ear marked through an organization I represent - for the past seven years that grant has now been paid to a different organization as I had a timeline to distribute the funds, another organization filled the paperwork out the next day and received the funds a month later - I sign the checks annually for them now and have provided a substantial amount of money - well over five figures - it was like I was not in the cool kids club so I could not be involved - I have harbored resentment since as I have been a volunteer since 1997.
I think this is all healthy - I live my best life when the bicycle is involved. While I generally ride alone, I am sure I internalize this as my cycling support group.

Seeing most of you at the F-Cancer ride last year was fantastic - I hope to relive that again soon and am more than willing to help set that up or something similar.

I should probably get my shears out as well and go trim some trails at Allaire (Not the WMA).

It would be great to setup a group for fund-raising events as well, such as the MS Coast the Coast ride. Not even the team - just as a group from the site. Maybe we setup a way to fund raise for something else using something similar to the Base Race event?

Re-reading this I feel like a Karen & and half - but I love to share ideas and I appreciate the feedback as well, whether you agree or don't. Maybe I am a dinosaur and am living in the past - everyone else's feedback may be a way to get out of it?
 
I used to live on a sport touring motorcycling web site. Posted some monumental Ride reports. Enjoyed the time there tremendously. Met many wonderful people at meets and the like. I retired from moto touring in 2018 after 75 thousand miles of moto touring. Spain, cross country tours x5. I kept going on the site for a few years but the site dwindled down to just a handful of posters talking about politics, gardening, movies and rarely a ride report.

What I’m saying is sites do that. Burn out.
I’m loving this site for all that I’ve learned about local riding that I didn’t know about. People I’ve met. Rides that I’ve been on with others here. I’m glad this site exists as it is now. Happy to check in and post.
Thanks Patrick!! Appreciate you. Never met you but all the same. Keep on keeping on.
 
I will answer a few that I feel I have a relevant response to.

1. Do you think the overall site format is less user-friendly today than it was in 2013? If so, is that because "actual content" doesn't really exist on the site anymore and it's all just buried in the slurry of threads?
3. To the point above, we have not seen this 20-40 demographic that you talk about.
I'm lumping these two together because from my perspective they are related. This assumes by "site format" you mean the vibe of the content and interaction of members. When I joined in 2006 I was 25, and my only responsibilities were my job and my relationship with my girlfriend who is now my wife. I was never a prolific content provider, I was more of an extra on the set. But nonetheless I was posting more, riding more, and generally had more time for social interaction. Also work was less demanding, I could pop into the site more during the day. Now that I'm on the north side of 40 free time is at a premium. I have a family, a house, and a lot more exhaustion. Truth be told, I start so many replies to threads, then I realize I just don't have the mental energy to complete my thought in a meaningful way so I delete the reply. Work is much more demanding these days as my career has progressed. The day is full of constant disruptions: cold calls, multiple inboxes to manage, teams messages, meetings, and oh the actual work that needs to be done. Ok less whining and back to the point, which is I'm not the only one in this boat. All of the other 20-40s from 2006 who are still here are most likely in the same position. By the time the kids are in bed I'm exhausted, I'd rather read a book then write something.

Also, the societal shift to consuming small bits of information likely plays a big role in how this site (and most other forums) have changed in the last 20 years. People are hooked on a 10 second video or a meme they can tag their friends in, or just hitting a like button next to a post. The creation of that content is someone else's role, we are just here to consume it. Social media is engineered to hijack your attention and get you addicted, and forums are much less "flashy" by comparison. With the current cohort of 20-40s coming of age in the social media era, it's no surprise they are not contributing to forums. I don't think it's a stretch to say they probably much more drawn to the facebook or tiktok format. Those of us 40+ began their internet socializing on forums and chat rooms, which is why we're likely to be drawn here instead. I mentioned above there's much less energy available to dedicate to online posting, and while I can't speak for everyone else, I wouldn't be surprised if they said the same.

2. The succession plan is a problem everywhere.
This again is another competing interest for someone's time, but why not start grooming people to take over? It might need to be the job of 3 or 4 instead of 1 or 2, I honestly don't know how you 2 find the time for the trails that you do. I commend you both and send endless thanks to Kirt and you and all of the others who contribute regularly.

6. I miss Norm's MTBNJ but I also consider that Team MTBNJ's MTBNJ - it feels like the days are past.
If the forum was exactly the same as it was in 2006 or 2010 or 2015 we would find ways to complain about that too. In fact, there did seem to be more of a "boys club" vibe to the posting back then which I don't think is here anymore. Of course the overall change here is likely the sum of many smaller changes. There are a lot of folks who used to post back then who have seemingly moved on (gtluke, fogerson, sounds, bonefishjake, biknben, soulchild, chrisru, and even the polarizing folks like Arwen's mom, Ron, and others I'm forgetting). At the same time, there are a lot more things vying for our digital attention now than there were 15 years ago. Also, as mentioned before, how many tire threads can we have?

There used to be trends: winter shoe posts would start winding up in late September, or a shitty weather day would start the internet equivalent of a food fight in the cafeteria. Now the trends have changed a bit: A lot of us use the forum as a repository of local knowledge for all things, not just cycling. We ask for advice on how to repair our hot water heaters, or where to grab a bit to eat in a town we don't often visit. I think the community here is stronger than it's ever been to be honest, it's just the natural evolution that has pulled a lot of different topics to the forefront. To me that's a sign that many people here trust one another. Where else are you going to find that on the internet?
 
Ok, it's here...I shall speak. I'm the @Norm generation and as much as some of my content has been passive aggressive...it's mild when compared to my motocross forum days. Secondly, @Norm is a dick. Seriously, but at the same time he's a phenomenal guy. The dick part probably comes from his "growing up with the internet". I get it. I love him, I hate him. No offers buddy. I'm sure the feeling is mutual(or maybe you don't love me). Seriously though, mtbnj was a great place for all mtb/road/gravel content and then the censoring came. I'd rather just be banned than have some one change my user profile and try and belittle me through it. The parts I didn't like but were kinda cool sort of...Rex Kwan Do is a result of me having my name changed from Turbo to my real name because @Norm didn't like what I posted. Then the short track was named after me. Cool, not cool I guess. Then, most recently, someone didn't like some of my posts and, well they could have blocked me, put me in jail etc. Nope, my mtbnj account was slowed down. How do I know? Incognito webpage and alter ego accounts that ran fine. MTBNJ. It's like a woman...you can't live with em and you can't live without em. Love you @Norm and @Johnny Utah and @Patrick
 
Dave Taylor said:
Ok, it's here...I shall speak. I'm the @Norm generation and as much as some of my content has been passive aggressive...it's mild when compared to my motocross forum days. Secondly, @Norm is a dick. Seriously, but at the same time he's a phenomenal guy. The dick part probably comes from his "growing up with the internet". I get it. I love him, I hate him. No offers buddy. I'm sure the feeling is mutual(or maybe you don't love me). Seriously though, mtbnj was a great place for all mtb/road/gravel content and then the censoring came. I'd rather just be banned than have some one change my user profile and try and belittle me through it. The parts I didn't like but were kinda cool sort of...Rex Kwan Do is a result of me having my name changed from Turbo to my real name because @Norm didn't like what I posted. Then the short track was named after me. Cool, not cool I guess. Then, most recently, someone didn't like some of my posts and, well they could have blocked me, put me in jail etc. Nope, my mtbnj account was slowed down. How do I know? Incognito webpage and alter ego accounts that ran fine. MTBNJ. It's like a woman...you can't live with em and you can't live without em. Love you @Norm and @Johnny Utah and @Patrick
Click to expand...

Oh man I read this whole thing and this popped up right when I finished, you really think norm or Patrick is making your log in slower? This is amazing
 
I don't think the lack of 20-40 year old riders is as bad as it seems. The assumption is being made that a 30 year old non-rider will never start riding.
My regular riding group is all guys who didn't get into MTB until they were 40+. (that's why we're just average riders)
A lot of 25 year olds are working on their careers, maybe living in a city or saving up for a house, saving up for an engagement ring and don't have 5k to drop on a bike.

Golf has always drawn an older crowd, maybe MTB is similar?
 
rlb said:
I will answer a few that I feel I have a relevant response to.

1. Do you think the overall site format is less user-friendly today than it was in 2013? If so, is that because "actual content" doesn't really exist on the site anymore and it's all just buried in the slurry of threads?
3. To the point above, we have not seen this 20-40 demographic that you talk about.
I'm lumping these two together because from my perspective they are related. This assumes by "site format" you mean the vibe of the content and interaction of members. When I joined in 2006 I was 25, and my only responsibilities were my job and my relationship with my girlfriend who is now my wife. I was never a prolific content provider, I was more of an extra on the set. But nonetheless I was posting more, riding more, and generally had more time for social interaction. Also work was less demanding, I could pop into the site more during the day. Now that I'm on the north side of 40 free time is at a premium. I have a family, a house, and a lot more exhaustion. Truth be told, I start so many replies to threads, then I realize I just don't have the mental energy to complete my thought in a meaningful way so I delete the reply. Work is much more demanding these days as my career has progressed. The day is full of constant disruptions: cold calls, multiple inboxes to manage, teams messages, meetings, and oh the actual work that needs to be done. Ok less whining and back to the point, which is I'm not the only one in this boat. All of the other 20-40s from 2006 who are still here are most likely in the same position. By the time the kids are in bed I'm exhausted, I'd rather read a book then write something.

Also, the societal shift to consuming small bits of information likely plays a big role in how this site (and most other forums) have changed in the last 20 years. People are hooked on a 10 second video or a meme they can tag their friends in, or just hitting a like button next to a post. The creation of that content is someone else's role, we are just here to consume it. Social media is engineered to hijack your attention and get you addicted, and forums are much less "flashy" by comparison. With the current cohort of 20-40s coming of age in the social media era, it's no surprise they are not contributing to forums. I don't think it's a stretch to say they probably much more drawn to the facebook or tiktok format. Those of us 40+ began their internet socializing on forums and chat rooms, which is why we're likely to be drawn here instead. I mentioned above there's much less energy available to dedicate to online posting, and while I can't speak for everyone else, I wouldn't be surprised if they said the same.

2. The succession plan is a problem everywhere.
This again is another competing interest for someone's time, but why not start grooming people to take over? It might need to be the job of 3 or 4 instead of 1 or 2, I honestly don't know how you 2 find the time for the trails that you do. I commend you both and send endless thanks to Kirt and you and all of the others who contribute regularly.

6. I miss Norm's MTBNJ but I also consider that Team MTBNJ's MTBNJ - it feels like the days are past.
If the forum was exactly the same as it was in 2006 or 2010 or 2015 we would find ways to complain about that too. In fact, there did seem to be more of a "boys club" vibe to the posting back then which I don't think is here anymore. Of course the overall change here is likely the sum of many smaller changes. There are a lot of folks who used to post back then who have seemingly moved on (gtluke, fogerson, sounds, bonefishjake, biknben, soulchild, chrisru, and even the polarizing folks like Arwen's mom, Ron, and others I'm forgetting). At the same time, there are a lot more things vying for our digital attention now than there were 15 years ago. Also, as mentioned before, how many tire threads can we have?

There used to be trends: winter shoe posts would start winding up in late September, or a shitty weather day would start the internet equivalent of a food fight in the cafeteria. Now the trends have changed a bit: A lot of us use the forum as a repository of local knowledge for all things, not just cycling. We ask for advice on how to repair our hot water heaters, or where to grab a bit to eat in a town we don't often visit. I think the community here is stronger than it's ever been to be honest, it's just the natural evolution that has pulled a lot of different topics to the forefront. To me that's a sign that many people here trust one another. Where else are you going to find that on the internet?
Click to expand...

Very, very well said here!
 
Norm said:
Ok I deleted the bulk of the message but wanted you to be notified that I replied to you. I am going to ask a series of questions. Also, I am going to say that you have now become the spokesman for the New Jersey EveryMan. Also, I trust that you are trying to help and make it better, so I am not trying to bait you into anything. I legit value your feedback.

1. Do you think the overall site format is less user-friendly today than it was in 2013?
Click to expand...
No
Norm said:
1a. If so, is that because "actual content" doesn't really exist on the site anymore and it's all just buried in the slurry of threads?
Click to expand...
Maybe buried but also less blogs and people adding content.
Norm said:
2. The succession plan is a problem everywhere. As a pretty active JORBA rep, we have this conversation all the time. Kirt and I are dumping a lot of time & effort into CR/Cromwell. We both know that in 5 years we may both be gone and who is going to pick that up? There is a very real chance it goes back to an eroded set of trails that struggle to be maintained. The same goes for the biking scene. Where is this 20-40 year old demographic that's going to take any of this over? It's a rhetorical question to me.
Click to expand...
Honestly this is the case for everything. it takes so much to keep anything going and unforntenly maintenance is never ever ending, ever.
Norm said:
3. To the point above, we have not seen this 20-40 demographic that you talk about. Like none, zero. Once in a blue moon we get someone in that age group and they disappear in a week.
4. I don't really know what sort of solution one might offer for the Norm/Patrick problem. We're never going to say, "Hey person X, you can't post that much." So it begs the question, who isn't posting? I think Patrick is trying to fill a gap to create content which is going to come from what he knows. So it'll be highly personal. That's natural and begs the question of the new demographic coming in to help that doesn't really exist.
Click to expand...
Everyone like something different with content. In the mtbnj racing hayday, we have many people posting and each was a bit different. Heavy numbers for the number people and a bunch of people moving up the ranks and posting about it. And content seems to breed content it would seem. I have had my fair share of threads and I think they added some good content outside of my normal banter, however how much can one talk about their daily happenings when it isnt that different day to day.
Norm said:
5. I generally dislike the ban option. In the past when I banned someone it was openly stated, and there was a timeline. More often than not they would come back and be fine. I am not aware of non-bots/spammers being blocked. On this note, I actually dislike the ignore user/thread button as it really means that people will not see the content there. That said, I have ignored threads for the reasons you mention. I simply do not care about cars yet it is the most popular thread here, with maybe the exception of beer, which I also ignore. The fact that Cars & Beer were at the top of the list every day for YEARS is what made me a little sad and start to detach. No matter what I do, BEER IS MORE IMPORTANT. I digress. I am joining your rowboat, TBH.
Click to expand...
Cars and beers are easy to talk about. I am not really a car person but I can take a ;picture of a cool car when i see one and post.
Norm said:
6. I miss Norm's MTBNJ but I also consider that Team MTBNJ's MTBNJ - it feels like the days are past. This is true of both the team and the site. Why is that? IDK. We have a similar disconnect with the team now in that we do not have a central focus to drive us like we used to in the past (races, events, etc).
Click to expand...
Outside of EPS, are there still "big" teams that race mtb? I see a bunch for road but not so much for mtb. Has the YDKSAMTB format taken over, massive group rides with hot dogs and beers at the end?
Norm said:
7. I believe the Hartshorne issue has been resolved, FTR.

I am open to whoever else wants to add feedback. I would love to have more weekly content posts from myself or others. I would love to do a podcast but I cannot drive that. I'd be more than happy to talk on a zoom call for 30 minutes and record it. But who has time for that?

I also wish the content was more-better-biglier. I struggle with this from time to time. But I also know I would need to just add more Norm to the mix and I struggle to commit to that.

I like turtles.
I love lamp.

Please anyone else add feedback. I won't ban you. Unless I don't like you. Then I will.

Just kidding. Maybe.
Click to expand...
 
Dave Taylor said:
Ok, it's here...I shall speak. I'm the @Norm generation and as much as some of my content has been passive aggressive...it's mild when compared to my motocross forum days. Secondly, @Norm is a dick. Seriously, but at the same time he's a phenomenal guy. The dick part probably comes from his "growing up with the internet". I get it. I love him, I hate him. No offers buddy. I'm sure the feeling is mutual(or maybe you don't love me). Seriously though, mtbnj was a great place for all mtb/road/gravel content and then the censoring came. I'd rather just be banned than have some one change my user profile and try and belittle me through it. The parts I didn't like but were kinda cool sort of...Rex Kwan Do is a result of me having my name changed from Turbo to my real name because @Norm didn't like what I posted. Then the short track was named after me. Cool, not cool I guess. Then, most recently, someone didn't like some of my posts and, well they could have blocked me, put me in jail etc. Nope, my mtbnj account was slowed down. How do I know? Incognito webpage and alter ego accounts that ran fine. MTBNJ. It's like a woman...you can't live with em and you can't live without em. Love you @Norm and @Johnny Utah and @Patrick
Click to expand...

@Norm In my opinion - this is a Prime example of some of my first posts on page one of this thread. While I am not going to go into everything @Dave Taylor represents in his post above I will note this:
  • Dave Taylor is a prime user of the site - he creates content, shows up to races and participates in MTBNJ group events such as week-day rides/TM.
  • He is willing to share everything
  • Further, I have NEVER seen Dave be negative in person, he is always willing to help. The guy cheers people on when they pass him in a race!
  • If Dave did not have thick skin, I think he would have been gone years ago (Maybe some people were hoping he was not so resilient). Others Like @Mountain Bike Mike and his brother Rob were given similar treatment from the boys club like there were nuts - all gone - these members went to the MTBNJ races and participated here but were 100% ganged up on. They were never replaced - over the last ten years how many others like this did the site/community loose? Those users were friends with other riders as well, that felt the same and boycotted this.
Does Dave posts some wild stuff - yes he does, but it does offer another state of mind. In my opinion, @Patrick is on the same track, just different material/content - but he has the keys to the castle. For me, when Dave posts I roll my eyes - but I read it.

I have zero doubt Dave's user account has been slowed down so he cannot post here or has issues doing so, it has been done to me. I am sure this is a much better PR friendly way to silence someone rather than the very public Ban/Time out that many of us made public and fought back on such as myself and @thegock . For example, the site works fine, but when you go to log in the speed slows to a 1,000th of what it is when not logged in. Clear cookies - they are clear and EVERY OTHER site I log into works fine, just this one. Dave is not crazy on this point - gang up on him all you want. In days past, when someone was blocked, the drama started (#freeTHEgock or #freeUTAH) - but with the slow down, it appears the user is just not interested in posting or defending themselves. Total BS.

Adjusting people's name and how they represent themselves without thier control is 100% bullying - this at a time when the site went DEI and PR friendly - people were getting banned/blocked for what the mod's felt was out of line, yet the mod's were bullying themselves. It is/was a 100% hypocritical move. I know @RobW (I think his name was changed to Flaubert?) was pretty upset about this as well. Do as I say, not as I do.

It is easy to say Dave is still here and allowed to participate, but my goodness has he been bloodied and beaten along the way.

The community has had other issues like this they turn a blind eye to or choose to ignore. Having volunteered at Allaire for maintenance since 1997, we used to have groups of 40+ people at maintenance days - lucky if there are five now or if the event is held and not canceled. Along the way there were plenty of people willing to help and put real time in - but they were all pushed out. Even simple things like getting sent out for "chainsaw training" - that went to select people that were in the boys club. The park has fallen - I used to trim A LOT of the park but have since moved away - no chainsaw training invite for me, in fact I was told I can't use power tools in the park because I am not trained. I volunteered there for 25+ years and have a college education in horticulture/soil science plus ten years field time operating 150,000 acres of farm ground across a wide scope of soil types, but since I didn't go to IMBA training for a weekend I have zero idea what I am talking about - OK. Some of the same people who were ostracized there went onto build a vast majority of the rouge trails in that park - I am not saying that is a good or bad thing.

Part of the succession plan was pushed out or discouraged. When it comes to the website/social media thing it is easier for them to start a Facebook group - if they are pushed out on a Facebook group the barriers of entry to start a new Facebook group is small - it starts up the same/next day. On MTBNJ.com I get it, there is a major investment in this website as well as the network of relationships made (sponsors/JORBA/Park Mangers/NICA, etc.). But that power is fading (or has). I think part of the cronies/old boys club have moved on - there is opportunity to rebuild.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom