Operation of Jungle Habitat for mountain biking recreational and events services.

Bleeder said:
The problem with going this route, is they (the winning bidder) would expect us JORBA, DVW and myself, to build, maintain and repair the trails for free.
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My first thought also.
Need to be careful here and pay attention.
 
Bleeder said:
The problem with going this route, is they (the winning bidder) would expect us JORBA, DVW and myself, to build, maintain and repair the trails for free.
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Well you already do that for free, the problem would be if they damaged trails and did not make repairs. Or they would have to stay clear of established mtb trails.
Our message to the state needs to be that there are established trails at Jungle which park users have enjoyed over the years and these trails should not be jeopardized because the state wants to make some money...only say it nicer. I'm sure this is already Jorba's platform. :)
 
pooriggy said:
Well you already do that for free, the problem would be if they damaged trails and did not make repairs. Or they would have to stay clear of established mtb trails.
Our message to the state needs to be that there are established trails at Jungle which park users have enjoyed over the years and these trails should not be jeopardized because the state wants to make some money...only say it nicer. I'm sure this is already Jorba's platform. :)
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True
 
jimvreeland said:
Agreed, MTB use is not where the money would come from. There is a ton of potential for other outdoor sports and recreational activities to happen that would bring in significantly more than the $1,000/month lease. Hell, if you held an Autocross once a month you'd make your money back 10-fold.
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I believe it explicitly excluded motorized vehicle activities.
 
Norm said:
I don't know if we can find that kind of financial donor given the time available to us. But I am fairly sure one exists. Can this be something realistic? I don't know, I would love to try and find out, help make it happen. I would not hold my breath but in this day and age of people sitting on their asses and complaining about things and not doing them, I am more than happy to be one of the few people who tries and fails as opposed to the scores of people who try nothing, fail at nothing, and succeed at nothing.
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This was my first thought also, but I think the real challenge is in the operation and maintenance, not the $12k a year. The liability insurance, keeping the place running, and meeting all of the BS requirements that go along with having a government contract are all huge hurdles.
 
Also, consider how many profitable days there are in a year. A snowy winter and a wet spring cuts into that. IMO this is a tough thing for anyone to pull off in NJ right now. How many companies are qualified for this? Six flags? Not sure I'd like to see a big corporation running a public park in NJ.
 
so this started back here... http://www.mtbnj.com/forum/threads/where-is-this-going-commercialization-of-jh.39622/


getting $$ to back something that would be profitable really isn't a problem.
what would be profitable?

mtb - day pass/season pass (jorba members are free of course - that is called leverage)
zip line/tree obstacle course (these are huge)
property history tours
something tied to the airport (meaning a rental bikes - i kid you not, pilots look for adventures)
mud runs/xterra
adventure racing (we know a guy)
trail ultras
is there a spot for a tubing hill? - this creates a cost problem, cause the parking lot would need to be plowed.
is wayway camping full?
transient rv parking/day pass

yes, bring back some otters! ok, maybe not. but some monkeys pulling off wiper blades would be a blast.

parking lot use - swap meet, go carts (electric), driving school, motorcycle training weekend, drive in movies, concert venue

Summer camp - maybe use portable buildings?

ok, that was 3 minutes of thinking. if anyone wants to flush it out, let me know. figure my consulting rate should prevent any reasonable profit
in the first 5 years ;)

yes - there would need to be a paid staff, or quid-pro-quo arrangement with trail maintenance workers - there are other models.
 
Bikini bike wash:)

Sorry for the trumpish locker room talk.

Come on @Norm would be great in a bikini.
 
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fidodie said:
so this started back here... http://www.mtbnj.com/forum/threads/where-is-this-going-commercialization-of-jh.39622/


getting $$ to back something that would be profitable really isn't a problem.
what would be profitable?

mtb - day pass/season pass (jorba members are free of course - that is called leverage)
zip line/tree obstacle course (these are huge)
property history tours
something tied to the airport (meaning a rental bikes - i kid you not, pilots look for adventures)
mud runs/xterra
adventure racing (we know a guy)
trail ultras
is there a spot for a tubing hill? - this creates a cost problem, cause the parking lot would need to be plowed.
is wayway camping full?
transient rv parking/day pass

yes, bring back some otters! ok, maybe not. but some monkeys pulling off wiper blades would be a blast.

parking lot use - swap meet, go carts (electric), driving school, motorcycle training weekend, drive in movies, concert venue

Summer camp - maybe use portable buildings?

ok, that was 3 minutes of thinking. if anyone wants to flush it out, let me know. figure my consulting rate should prevent any reasonable profit
in the first 5 years ;)

yes - there would need to be a paid staff, or quid-pro-quo arrangement with trail maintenance workers - there are other models.
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Yes, that was from the Request for information, I sent in a bike park w/ epics attached. Now this is the request for proposal.

Pretty much all these ideas were/are considered, I'm just disappointed the state is not factoring in the time and money it will take to implement them before any sort of decent revenue can be generated. I'm afraid with the contract as is, we are not going to be able to bid on it.
 
My stance is I will not pay to ride my bike anywhere unless there is a chairlift and i think most mountain bikers feel the same way. If there's a fee to ride Jungle, no matter how good it is, i will not ride there because there are some many other free options. I hope this just goes away and everything remains status quo.
 
gmb3 said:
My stance is I will not pay to ride my bike anywhere unless there is a chairlift and i think most mountain bikers feel the same way. If there's a fee to ride Jungle, no matter how good it is, i will not ride there because there are some many other free options. I hope this just goes away and everything remains status quo.
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I guess most mountain bikers have not been to kingdom trails And paid $15 to ride in heaven .
 
gmb3 said:
My stance is I will not pay to ride my bike anywhere unless there is a chairlift and i think most mountain bikers feel the same way. If there's a fee to ride Jungle, no matter how good it is, i will not ride there because there are some many other free options. I hope this just goes away and everything remains status quo.
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Wissahickon in Philly actually has an annual trail user permit for bikers and equestrians, $20 for non-residents of the city and $0 for residents, but a minimum dontation of $20 is requested. While it's not strictly enforced, if caught without a permit, $25 fine.

http://www.phila.gov/ParksandRecreation/placestogo/trails/Pages/TrailPermits.aspx

Disclaimer: Been riding in Wiss since '93 and can count on 1 hand the number of years that I had a permit. Only been caught once and that was probably 20 years ago.
 
What he said. The state is trying to get blood from a stone. Why would you pay to ride here when you can go 5 minutes down the road and ride Waywayanda or Ringwood.

gmb3 said:
My stance is I will not pay to ride my bike anywhere unless there is a chairlift and i think most mountain bikers feel the same way. If there's a fee to ride Jungle, no matter how good it is, i will not ride there because there are some many other free options. I hope this just goes away and everything remains status quo.
Click to expand...
 
Moreover, once they go with this pattern with Jungle, maybe they will go the same way with all of the other places we ride. You may be okay with paying a fee to ride one park, but what if every park you ride has a separate fee. Knowing our state government, if they find this to be profitable, it will be duplicated in every other park in NJ.
 
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