How the hell are we supposed to retire?

oh god don't even get me started with "I wish I did...." "what if..." I've learned over the past 10 yrs.

Hey man, take it easy. I was just asking. You make valid points which I am on the same page. mid $300s. You could either be a bad property manager or a really great one. And yes my wife would appreciate that if she knew how to.

Saving is the hardest part either it be not growing, growing minimally, growing benchmark, or hopefully exponentially growing on speculation.

"Good money Karma" if you believe it or not
 
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Patrick said:
That is exactly what i'm saying.
so tell me what it was worth then, and what it is worth now - just so i have an idea.
were you going to live there, and rent out next door? Your wife is going to appreciate unclogging a toilet at 2am
when you aren't around.

then you are going to saddle your next generation with a two family home where they have to be the landlord?
maybe tie up $500k+ so they can make $4000/mo in rent - less fees/insurance/upkeep/pain in the ass renters/taxes
vs just having it in the bank throwing off dividends or growing with the market?

did it do better than tesla over the last 6 months? hell if you are going to speculate, may as well pick the winner
as the example.

remember - 5% dividend yield is easy to get. the money shows up monthly, you don't need to do a thing.
get yourself cash flow positive, and keep plowing it into investments.
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ive got to agree - i have a rental property and i just dont like dealing with it. I have a rental management company that manages it. they do a good job, but its expensive. we tried to do it on our own, but dealing with tenants and the bullshit just wasn't worth it. in addition, the property hasn't grown in value all that much so the ROI is something like 15 years. id rather have the money back and in index funds or potentially a dividend portfolio. with all that being said, we just didn't buy in the right location. if it wouldve been in a different town i may be singing a different tune.
 
THATmanMANNY said:
buy only if you willing to hold many years

@Patrick are you saying I shouldn't buy rental properties as a side thing that will 20+ yrs turn to set for life/generations. Man, the Mrs wishes she listened to me when I proposed to buy a two family home in Somerville last decade to start
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I wouldn't buy any real estate as an investment until the market bottoms out. Still seems to be in the decline in NJ.
 
MissJR said:
Question concerning Roth IRA: when do you determine when to contribute and how much to contribute in the case of what your gross income and all that stuff is? I always thought it best to just contribute as soon as you had the extra money. But apparently my thought process might not be the best. I guess what I'm asking is: Do you just wait until W-2 and contribute before filing tax returns?
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Is there any reason you are not going to a pro? There are Roth conversions, pre-load strategies, etc. Painting a room can be done by you and your husband, planning a financial future, you may want professional advice. And not by a temp H&R Block tax season worker, but from a year round person who knows even the latest tax changes (like the one that was updated last week).
Not knocking anyone here, but somethings are best handled by those who do them day in and out.
 
JerseyPete said:
Is there any reason you are not going to a pro? There are Roth conversions, pre-load strategies, etc. Painting a room can be done by you and your husband, planning a financial future, you may want professional advice. And not by a temp H&R Block tax season worker, but from a year round person who knows even the latest tax changes (like the one that was updated last week).
Not knocking anyone here, but somethings are best handled by those who do them day in and out.
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i don't disagree.
on the other hand, savings for retirement isn't rocket science.
once you have enough money to worry about, you'll need a good lawyer, and tax accountant.

use the vanguard advisers or adviser-bot. not on commission. don't sell insurance as their other line of business.

disclaimer.
i have an adviser at chase. they take .8%/12 (whatever that is) per month as their management fee.
at one meeting, he is trying to get some of the other money we have (which i manage) by telling me that the team will anticipate
and move faster than me. i note that i'm outperforming him by more than the commission. he still claims it is the anticipation
that will win in the long run. Next time i'm in, he suggests we take a chunk of money and put it in a protected account.
basically let an insurance co use it, and they guarantee some performance number capped high and low because he was worried
about the market correction. I reminded him that we pay his people to move the money, why is he asking me to protect the downside?
shouldn't they be doing that?

The only reason i have money in chase is an equity backed line of credit. This is an extremely cheap way to borrow money, because
they are holding the collateral, and can call it if the ratios fall below a certain level. they have to manage the portfolio to do this.
my current balance is zero on the line - but it is nice to know it is there. (as opposed to a home equity line - which is in the coming.)
 
JerseyPete said:
Is there any reason you are not going to a pro?
Click to expand...

No... You're right. I'm at the point where I should get better financial planning advice. I do have an appointment coming up. But I also didn't think I'd encounter some of the issues I'm running into because they weren't expected (such as the company being sold and everything that comes with that)
 
Patrick said:
i don't disagree.
on the other hand, savings for retirement isn't rocket science.
once you have enough money to worry about, you'll need a good lawyer, and tax accountant.

use the vanguard advisers or adviser-bot. not on commission. don't sell insurance as their other line of business.

disclaimer.
i have an adviser at chase. they take .8%/12 (whatever that is) per month as their management fee.
at one meeting, he is trying to get some of the other money we have (which i manage) by telling me that the team will anticipate
and move faster than me. i note that i'm outperforming him by more than the commission. he still claims it is the anticipation
that will win in the long run. Next time i'm in, he suggests we take a chunk of money and put it in a protected account.
basically let an insurance co use it, and they guarantee some performance number capped high and low because he was worried
about the market correction. I reminded him that we pay his people to move the money, why is he asking me to protect the downside?
shouldn't they be doing that?

The only reason i have money in chase is an equity backed line of credit. This is an extremely cheap way to borrow money, because
they are holding the collateral, and can call it if the ratios fall below a certain level. they have to manage the portfolio to do this.
my current balance is zero on the line - but it is nice to know it is there. (as opposed to a home equity line - which is in the coming.)
Click to expand...
Stories from a millionaire, lol
 
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MissJR said:
No... You're right. I'm at the point where I should get better financial planning advice. I do have an appointment coming up. But I also didn't think I'd encounter some of the issues I'm running into because they weren't expected (such as the company being sold and everything that comes with that)
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Btw, I am talking about tax specialists and not financial advisers.
 
Patrick said:
the point is the adviser is going to steer you towards the product that makes them the most money
if they are on commission. Not all of them take their fiduciary responsibility seriously.
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If you're ever curious about how much the Financial Folks care about you, take a stroll through Short Hills. Those S-Works and Aston Martins don't pay for themselves, you all do.
 
MissJR said:
No... You're right. I'm at the point where I should get better financial planning advice. I do have an appointment coming up. But I also didn't think I'd encounter some of the issues I'm running into because they weren't expected (such as the company being sold and everything that comes with that)
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yes - a good accountant that you pay a fee too will be able to help. be very careful with someone who calls themselves a financial advisor.
 
Patrick said:
i don't disagree.
on the other hand, savings for retirement isn't rocket science.
once you have enough money to worry about, you'll need a good lawyer, and tax accountant.

use the vanguard advisers or adviser-bot. not on commission. don't sell insurance as their other line of business.

disclaimer.
i have an adviser at chase. they take .8%/12 (whatever that is) per month as their management fee.
at one meeting, he is trying to get some of the other money we have (which i manage) by telling me that the team will anticipate
and move faster than me. i note that i'm outperforming him by more than the commission. he still claims it is the anticipation
that will win in the long run. Next time i'm in, he suggests we take a chunk of money and put it in a protected account.
basically let an insurance co use it, and they guarantee some performance number capped high and low because he was worried
about the market correction. I reminded him that we pay his people to move the money, why is he asking me to protect the downside?
shouldn't they be doing that?

The only reason i have money in chase is an equity backed line of credit. This is an extremely cheap way to borrow money, because
they are holding the collateral, and can call it if the ratios fall below a certain level. they have to manage the portfolio to do this.
my current balance is zero on the line - but it is nice to know it is there. (as opposed to a home equity line - which is in the coming.)
Click to expand...
unfortunately I've had the same experience and fell for it a few years back. i had some of my money locked up in a "protected account" which was actually an annuity for 6 years. It did OK, but not as well if it were just in well diversified index funds. After i pressed the financial advisor about how she was paid it all made sense. 1% may not seem like much but over the course of 30 years that can be 100k. that forced me to do all of my own research and manage my own investments. at least until i'm closer to retirement and need the help (im 36). ive done a lot of research on the vanguard advisor and i think its a good service.
 
jimvreeland said:
If you're ever curious about how much the Financial Folks care about you, take a stroll through Short Hills. Those S-Works and Aston Martins don't pay for themselves, you all do.
Click to expand...

Whether they "care about us" is irrelevant. It's like anything else (e.g. working on our bikes) - you can try to do it yourself, or you can pay an expert to do it. I choose the latter.
 
MissJR said:
No... You're right. I'm at the point where I should get better financial planning advice. I do have an appointment coming up. But I also didn't think I'd encounter some of the issues I'm running into because they weren't expected (such as the company being sold and everything that comes with that)
Click to expand...
Beware of "financial advisors".

jimvreeland said:
If you're ever curious about how much the Financial Folks care about you, take a stroll through Short Hills. Those S-Works and Aston Martins don't pay for themselves, you all do.
Click to expand...
Also, 100% this. All of those people work in "finance".
 
The problem comes down to the idea that you can't outsource give a shit. You can decide that finance is boring, complicated, rigged, and all of that is true. But then you pay some advisor 1% of your assets to manage your money. He puts you into a selection of products that also charge some percent. You assume he is giving a shit about your money. (By the way, he takes this 1% every year!) Consider this: If the advisor wants to double his money, he either has to double YOUR money, or find another you. So he is spending his time looking for another you, not watching after you. You assume you have outsourced give a shit. Like others here, I have tested and benchmarked advisors, and then fired them. I give more shits about my money than they do.
While doing finance right is complex and takes a lot of time, you can probably get to 90% right with very little effort. There are roboadvisors, retirement date funds that do asset allocation for you, Dividend reinvestment plans. Put the money in consistently, don't raid it, and you will get to 90% of perfect. I have a small group of friends where we have an informal investment club. We discuss:

What is your asset allocation, and why?
What percent pre-vs.-aft tax?
What are your Roth strategies? Your FICA strategies?
What Finance books are you reading?

There is a certain amount of peer-pressure habit reinforcement we supply each other by just having these discussions.

We learn about anything we give a shit about. Just look at the 27.5 discussion. We don't have to become finance experts, but we can learn enough finance to ace retirement. Your future self will thank you.
 
MissJR said:
Question concerning Roth IRA: when do you determine when to contribute and how much to contribute in the case of what your gross income and all that stuff is? I always thought it best to just contribute as soon as you had the extra money. But apparently my thought process might not be the best. I guess what I'm asking is: Do you just wait until W-2 and contribute before filing tax returns?
Click to expand...
The first Roth contribution is key. It starts the five year waiting period for this, and all future contributions. That five year period begins January 1 of the year the contribution is for. You could make an initial contribution now for 2019, and 1.25 of the five year period would already be met.
When to contribute during the year is not as critical as making the contribution every year. We are limited to something like $6k per year, so to grow your retirement account, you want to contribute the max every year.
 
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