Cars, it's electric! Do Do Do

bucknejo said:
EV experience at the risk of generating more rage:

Yesterday I drove my Model Y LR to Belleayre Mountain Ski Center from Allendale, NJ - distance ~ 104 miles. I made it to Belleayre driving between 70 and 90 mph (climate on most of the way) with 51% remaining charge (from 100% start). The battery and cabin climate were preconditioned before departure.

Skied from 9am to 1pm. Sentry mode used maybe ~ 1% as I started the trip home at 50%. Stopped at the Kingston, NY Quick Check Tesla supercharger next to the Thruway for a ~ 10 min supercharge back to 60% from 33% ($8.36) and made it home with 30%. I drove home faster on the Thruway for sure, not so much route 28 from the mountain to Kingston.

I've had the car for about a year & it's great. In that time I've clocked 8.5k miles and charged a total of 2,600 kWh, mostly at home, for a total of $167. I had one tire replaced early in the milage due to user error (hit a curb), but other than this, the $167 is all I've put into it for the year.

My opinion:
  • I like being able to plug the thing in overnight to charge to whatever SoC I'll need for the next day
  • A little bit of planning (mostly done by the Tesla nav) is required for road trips if you think you'll exceed range
  • I've supercharged exactly 3x (the other 2x times were on a trip to Saratoga springs) so for me, I normally don't exceed range on any given day and can recharge easily overnight
  • For the mathletes out there -> the Model Y LR has a stated range of ~ 315 miles. Yes, 49% for 104 miles doesn't add up. There are plenty of factors for why this is the case (elevation, climate -> google it, I'm sure you'll find more). I'm not crazy about how Tesla states total range but I don't care b/c the car is that good and if I didn't drive it like I stole it, it would be more efficient.
  • The upfront cost of the car was pretty steep, but I think total cost of ownership will probably lean in my favor
Final note: I know my use case is not for everyone, just throwing it out there for others curious about EVs and day trips just outside the full range of the vehicle + some other details about charging.
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Not rage but actual comparison to any of my 3 ICE vehicles and I'm sure millions of other ICE vehicle drivers:

Drive for at least 300 miles. City, highway, mixed, whatever and where ever.

Orange low fuel light comes on, pull in to a gas station that is usually within minutes of just about anywhere. Will the fuel pump be compatible with my car? Yes because refueling is standardized for literally every single vehicle of any year, make, and model.

How will I pay? What app do I need to use? Every pump takes any credit card you have. Want to pay cash? No problem.

There is zero exaggeration with some sarcasm but you get my drift. We take road trips a lot so refueling is important to us (available where and when we need it). With our 3.5L V6 AWD SUV we use for road trips we've been averaging 25-27 MPG consistently and reliably when fully loaded with family and luggage for a week. Sometimes with 3 bikes attached (see photo of our trip to Canada). It's been proven over and over again that estimated range for an EV is based on the most optimum conditions and that range is drastically decreased when loaded down, driving in windy or adverse weather, and if AC/heater is being used.

My final note: I don't see nor anyone has been able to give me a singe reason why an EV would be better in any way than my ICE vehicles.
 

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1TrackMind said:
It’s my understanding that Teslas with a dual motor optimize 1 motor for lower speed and the second motor for highway speed. Power routed accordingly based on the situation, achieving efficiency w/o the trans.
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No longer. They changed their motors so that they're identical and are able to get the low and high end performance without winding the motors differently.

I brought up the same thing probably 50 pages ago in this thread and someone pointed me to that fact somewhere.

For most driving it's pointless. I doubt 95% of the people driving a Porsche Taycan for instance ever get into 2nd gear.

-----

I kind of want an electric car because I found out I have a free charging station at the end of my street, and there's free charging in my downtown. But I know with free electricity it's still way cheaper to just keep my car.

Also, it's a crime how expensive electric golf carts are compared to cars.
 
one piece crank said:
Thanks. This was a great, actual experience. One question - how long do you plan to keep this specific Tesla?
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Should another thread be started by those on board who own or drive EV's and give real experience and comparisons to our ICE vehicles we used to own or still own?
This thread was started by Max and I doubt he is on board anymore. It has also splintered into different areas and opinions. As @THATmanMANNY has stated, it is not about convincing people to get an EV, but time is better spent answering questions.
Are there specific questions for EV owners and drivers (Tesla, Leaf, Bolt etc. )? Before getting ours, I would walk up to strangers in parking lots and ask them about their experience and what they felt were pros and cons. After a year of research and talking with people, we went for it.
Me: 2022 Model 3 Long Range. My wife is the primary driver.
 
Patrick said:
did ya see the carbon neutral eFuels ?

hint: they use electricity to produce it

www.cnbc.com

Porsche begins production of 'e-fuel' that could provide gas alternative amid EV push

Porsche officials celebrated the beginning of e-fuel production with the filling of a Porsche 911 with the first synthetic fuel produced at the site.
www.cnbc.com www.cnbc.com
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I think with current technology this a much better path forward than evs for most people. Not that options are bad but given the infrastructure challenges associated with evs they are a long way away from being a long term solution.

P.s. is Porsche doing the carbon capture for this fuel or is that someone else making gasoline substitutes?
 
tonyride said:
My final note: I don't see nor anyone has been able to give me a singe reason why an EV would be better in any way than my ICE vehicles.
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Better by what metric? EVs are #1 and #3 top ten fastest production cars in the world (0 to 60 and quarter mile). And #2 Bugatti ICE costs $3.8 million. Another advantage is mechanical simplicity.
 
rick81721 said:
Better by what metric? EVs are #1 and #3 top ten fastest production cars in the world (0 to 60 and quarter mile). And #2 Bugatti ICE costs $3.8 million. Another advantage is mechanical simplicity.
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A huge push for EVs is coming from the bean counters at the car companies. If you take out the expensive battery what you end up with is a relatively simple car. Way less parts, way less complicated assembly, way less costly employees. Drive-trains are expensive.

If the batteries get cheaper there could be way more profit.
 
shrpshtr325 said:
I think with current technology this a much better path forward than evs for most people. Not that options are bad but given the infrastructure challenges associated with evs they are a long way away from being a long term solution.

P.s. is Porsche doing the carbon capture for this fuel or is that someone else making gasoline substitutes?
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Yes carbon capture but ridiculously complex and expensive. It's just a gimmick

https://www.motortrend.com/features/porsche-supercup-efuel-direct-air-carbon-capture/
 
rick81721 said:
Yes carbon capture but ridiculously complex and expensive. It's just a gimmick

https://www.motortrend.com/features/porsche-supercup-efuel-direct-air-carbon-capture/
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complicated and expensive or not i think with current technology its a better option than batteries (not to say batteries wont improve, they likely will) but this is backwards compatible with vehicles already on the road. It has many advantages over pushing everyone to battery electrics even in its current seemingly immature state.
 
but it’s not about one single reason that EVs are better. If it doesn’t work for you then it doesn’t. No one wants you stranded on your road trips or inconvenience you.

Again, overall Personal experience - 8 years of EVs (4 used, 1 new), 100k miles, under $50 charging, that’s $16,000 gas (very approximate). At this moment, I think I’ve near even factoring in depreciation, a few tires, cars worth more that it was). Assuming 100k miles, 25mpg alternative, 15 gallon tank, 8 minute gas visit. It’s 35hrs…. I also drove 4 hrs previous week roundtrip non stop to pick up my Beargrease.

The Cons below aren’t important to us and I’m probably missing some in each category.

PROS
-torque, drove all the different EVs quick
-can “idle” all day and work in car
-kids nap in “idling” car
-precondition car from anywhere
-no key, start car remote, shift car remotely
-gas money
-time saved not gasing (estimate 35 hrs over 8 years)
-no fluid changes (time saved DIY or at service)
-dream of sleeping in EV while running AC for solo overnight adventures

CONS
-range is affected in winter
-3-5 supercharges on long road trips for vacations (this has occurred 3 times for us and maybe used 3hrs of time but we always got a meal or took a bathroom and walking break)
 
shrpshtr325 said:
complicated and expensive or not i think with current technology its a better option than batteries (not to say batteries wont improve, they likely will) but this is backwards compatible with vehicles already on the road. It has many advantages over pushing everyone to battery electrics even in its current seemingly immature state.
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Disagree - it's silly. Better option is to make the vehicle flex-fuel compatible and utilize current mature ethanol supply.
 
rick81721 said:
Yeah, Porsche should make their cars run on e85 rather than go through these ridiculous efuel machinations.
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need a better source of ethanol than corn to do that, dont want the fuel supply and the food supply competing for resources. . . .

this is an easier sell to the ecowarriors too as its 'carbon nuetral' fuel as long as they use carbon captured from the atmosphere it does not ADD to the current 'problem'
 
rick81721 said:
Yeah, Porsche should make their cars run on e85 rather than go through these ridiculous efuel machinations.
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I mean I know its great for making 2000hp turbo cars run 6s....but you arent saving any money with e85 since you need alot more of it vs gasoline. PLus as @shrpshtr325 just mentioned....scaling up the usage of it becomes an issues since we cant make enough of it using corn. The only reason its even a thing right now is because of the massive govt. subsidies, which I know you love.
 
shrpshtr325 said:
need a better source of ethanol than corn to do that, dont want the fuel supply and the food supply competing for resources. . . .

this is an easier sell to the ecowarriors too as its 'carbon nuetral' fuel as long as they use carbon captured from the atmosphere it does not ADD to the current 'problem'
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It's coming. Conversion of cellulosic biomass (i.e. corncobs) to ethanol is feasible. Costs are coming down.
 
UtahJoe said:
I mean I know its great for making 2000hp turbo cars run 6s....but you arent saving any money with e85 since you need alot more of it vs gasoline. PLus as @shrpshtr325 just mentioned....scaling up the usage of it becomes an issues since we cant make enough of it using corn. The only reason its even a thing right now is because of the massive govt. subsidies, which I know you love.
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It's much cheaper than Porsche's ridiculous efuel! See my comment to Bill re: making ethanol from any cellulose feedstock.
 
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