E-bikes are a thing

[jdog]

Ooo... is this closer to production? Did they let you ride it?

The DH bike is really incredible… Apparently they’re just gonna keep making these prototypes and keep them out in the public eye until they absolutely nail the geometry and kinematics



After that you will see a new Phoenix that will then be about 2 pounds lighter than these lugged versions.

In the past, they did prototypes out of welded aluminum, but the trouble is that when they went to build it in carbon, it didn’t ride exactly the same

I know that I sound like a Pivot fanboy/but these guys do a lot of things right

Very little of what they do is for fashion. They try everything trending and anything you can think of. They’ve already pretty much thought of it.

Chris is as smart as he seems, he’s always humble and takes the time to answer ever stupid question we throw at him.

I will say that they have a new bike coming out in the very near future (that’s why I’m here), and for the first time in a long time, the next generation of bike doesn’t seem a lot different on paper in the prior version. It is, in fact, more than a subtle revision, but it does seem like technology and bicycles are hitting a little bit of a plateau. It’s also clear that at these dealer events, the tide is changing on the dealer perception of eBikes. When I first came to these events in Rode ebikes, I was one of the few people would even try them. Now everyone wants to ride them.

The shuttle am is such a good bike, but just also happens to be in ebike.

 

[tonyride]

Please don't say Super Duper Boost is coming. 😜

 

[scott62]

Ooo... is this closer to production? Did they let you ride it?

Sorry, plastic dh bikes are stupid. mountain creak tech loves plastic. I had a theory that bike companies location played a roll in the design of their bikes. Pivot brakes that rule, I can think no bike pivot makes that I would want to ride in South mountain AZ, the closest trail to their offices. Plastic bikes going up and down rock staircases sounds like a day taking to customer support for lots of impact fractures from dropping your bike down those rock staircases.

 

[Santapez]

Sorry, plastic dh bikes are stupid. mountain creak tech loves plastic. I had a theory that bike companies location played a roll in the design of their bikes. Pivot brakes that rule, I can think no bike pivot makes that I would want to ride in South mountain AZ, the closest trail to their offices. Plastic bikes going up and down rock staircases sounds like a day taking to customer support for lots of impact fractures from dropping your bike down those rock staircases.

As someone who went carbon on their prior bike and went aluminum with current higher travel bike, I couldn't agree more. Sure it's heavier but I don't really notice it, and besides being cheaper I don't worry about the carbon.

 

[JimN]

I don't worry about the carbon.

If anyone looked at the underside of my plastic fat bike, they probably wouldn't worry about carbon either.

 

[Bike N Gear]

Sorry, plastic dh bikes are stupid. mountain creak tech loves plastic. I had a theory that bike companies location played a roll in the design of their bikes. Pivot brakes that rule, I can think no bike pivot makes that I would want to ride in South mountain AZ, the closest trail to their offices. Plastic bikes going up and down rock staircases sounds like a day taking to customer support for lots of impact fractures from dropping your bike down those rock staircases.

Carbon can be repaired. Aluminum, not so much.

 

[tonyride]

Do people worry or think about repairability of the frame when they decide on a bike? Maybe some do but I don't. I haven't broken any frames yet but I have dented a chainstay on an aluminum bike and I rode it like that for years. Then I sold the bike and the new owner rode it for few more years. I don't know what caused that dent but I suspect the impact that caused it would have destroyed a carbon chainstay and I wouldn't even think about reparing it and just sprung for a new rear triangle. ATM I don't have a single aluminum framed mountain bike but not because I think the material is inferior. If the aluminum version of my Rise was available when I got mine I would have picked that over my carbon one.

 

[shrpshtr325]

Do people worry or think about repairability of the frame when they decide on a bike? Maybe some do but I don't. I haven't broken any frames yet but I have dented a chainstay on an aluminum bike and I rode it like that for years. Then I sold the bike and the new owner rode it for few more years. I don't know what caused that dent but I suspect the impact that caused it would have destroyed a carbon chainstay and I wouldn't even think about reparing it and just sprung for a new rear triangle. ATM I don't have a single aluminum framed mountain bike but not because I think the material is inferior. If the aluminum version of my Rise was available when I got mine I would have picked that over my carbon one.

alot of people worry about things that in reality wont affect them, most people will never damage a frame al or carbon (or steel or ti for that matter), and the mfg solution for either one is replacement (if you want to be all official about it), both can be repaired aftermarket if you have the correct resources available. Also ask yourself do you even keep a bike long enough to justify this concern (those who are worried about it).

I have broken both frame types, the al has always failed on a weld, the carbon had help (so idk if that one counts).

 

[Ian F]

Carbon over aluminum for me most of the time. I reference the literal pile of broken aluminum DH frame parts behind me as I type this. I've broken a steel frame as well. So if anything can break, I'll go with the lightest option, although if cost-no-object a Ti frame would be nice.

I follow Bernard Kerr's YT channel, so I've been watching him and other racers on that bike for a while now. It does look interesting, although I'm still not entirely sold on the mullet idea. At least for me and how I ride DH. I still prefer a full 29er.

 

[Steve Vai]

A rock that will break a carbon frame will also break any other frame. The days of carbon being a weaker material are long gone. And besides that a frame is a billion times more likely to crack at a weld, which carbon doesn’t have.

Having said all that, I only own 1 carbon bike…and it’s a road bike 😂

 

[scott62]

Carbon can be repaired. Aluminum, not so much.

Drop your alloy dh bike in a rock field…. Time for some touch up paint, drop your plastic dh bike in a rock field, time for frame repair. Plastic bikes do not handle surface impacts as well as alloy bikes. Do yourself a favor, keep the plastic on the road.

 

[Ian F]

Drop your alloy dh bike in a rock field…. Time for some touch up paint, drop your plastic dh bike in a rock field, time for frame repair. Plastic bikes do not handle surface impacts as well as alloy bikes. Do yourself a favor, keep the plastic on the road.

All of the previously mentioned broken DH frame parts are from rock strikes. They didn't break or crack but bent and thus put the frame out of alignment and unrideable with the rear tire locked up against the chain or seat stay. Depending on the age of the frame, the manufacturer may or may not have replacements. While repairs are theoretically possible, it requires metal working skills and heat treating that don't come cheap.

Could the same rock strike break a carbon frame? Sure. But in my experience, not as often and there are a growing number of vendors who can repair that damage for minimal cost.

 

[johnbryanpeters]

All of the previously mentioned broken DH frame parts are from rock strikes. They didn't break or crack but bent and thus put the frame out of alignment and unrideable with the rear tire locked up against the chain or seat stay. Depending on the age of the frame, the manufacturer may or may not have replacements. While repairs are theoretically possible, it requires metal working skills and heat treating that don't come cheap.

Could the same rock strike break a carbon frame? Sure. But in my experience, not as often and there are a growing number of vendors who can repair that damage for minimal cost.

"repair"

 

[jdog]

Please don't say Super Duper Boost is coming. 😜

Drop your alloy dh bike in a rock field…. Time for some touch up paint, drop your plastic dh bike in a rock field, time for frame repair. Plastic bikes do not handle surface impacts as well as alloy bikes. Do yourself a favor, keep the plastic on the road.

This might be eye opening.

Maybe not.

Here is a photo from this mornings ride.

Not sucking

 

[EJphotos]

Since when does an ebike need a Chevy 350 water pump?

 

[tonyride]

This might be eye opening.

Maybe not.

Interesting video. I can appreciate the strength of carbon vs. aluminum as how it was tested but this invites a lot more questions which I won't ask in fear of getting banned or at very least piss off some people. Besides, who's going to answer them? I've done enough testing in my career to know what to look for and what questions to ask to figure out the difference between what looks and what is good given the item's intended use and the environment it will be used in. Carbon is great. I currently have 2 carbon bikes and many more that I've owned in the past so I'm not dissing it. All I'm saying is it is not a must for me and I certainly don't think about how repairable the frame material is as a deciding factor which is the subject of my rant.

 

[Ironjunk]

i'd like to see the same test with a pre damaged frame. We all know carbon is strong and when it fails the first question is was it already damaged.

 

[a.s.]

i'd like to see the same test with a pre damaged frame. We all know carbon is strong and when it fails the first question is was it already damaged.

Definitely. I can put minor nicks and dents in my alloy DH frame and not worry much. Can’t say the same for carbon. Once you’ve put a dent or hole in the frame, the entire carbon structure is compromised. With those speeds and loads, I’d be scared to take it on any DH runs.

 

[Patrick]

Quick question -

Isn't a slightly heavier bike more stable at DH speeds/bump absorption?
I don't DH, but it seems like it would be a thing.

 

[sundaydoug]

Quick question -

Isn't a slightly heavier bike more stable at DH speeds/bump absorption?
I don't DH, but it seems like it would be a thing.

I remember seeing pictures of a few bikes at one of last year's WC races with weights attached to the frame around the BB area. Probably depends on the track though.