Lyme Disease Thread

I'm in! Got a shot. Let you know in a couple years if it was the vaccine or not.

I qualified but I bowed out after learning the closest site was Hoboken and I'd have to go back there 5+ times over the 2 years. Would've loved to do it too. Meh.

Permethrin application is on the schedule today for all our outdoor stuff.
 
Yup @Rick8675309 beat me to it, but yeah, that’s what you got.
Basically designed just like the Covid vax (and all other vax) studies.

18k participating is to ensure precision in the estimated rates of Lyme+
More data = more precision.
Sample size would also be determined by rates of Lyme in general- something that has lower rates means you need more data points for accurate precision.
Will probably do incidence rates overall and by confirmed bites to determine if it works.

Efficacy studies precede effectiveness studies. Efficacy being ideal controlled conditions - best case scenario.
Effectiveness studies follow- real world conditions.
Given they had some exclusion criteria, this might be efficacy, can’t say for sure.

If they ask you to sleep naked in the woods, I’d probably discontinue participation, unless you’re into that sort of thing.

Aren't there too many variable in this study to be considered effective? Is the vaccine preventing the lyme disease to take after you're bitten or the bites altogether (we already have a bunch of nasty chemicals for that so I wouldn't think so)?

Out of ignorance these are the points that bother me in term of understanding the effectiveness of the study:

1 - do all ticks carry lyme?
2 - do all bites of lyme carrying ticks transfer the disease to the person?
3 - different people take different preventive measures before going in the woods, so that would affect the study as well and how?

To me the only effective way to actually inoculate the test subjects with lyme and see if they actually get the disease, but I guess we don't do these things any more?

Basically, you have no idea if you didn't get it because you were never exposed or because when exposed the vaccine did its job.

P.S. Wow that was an old post...oops!
 
Aren't there too many variable in this study to be considered effective? Is the vaccine preventing the lyme disease to take after you're bitten or the bites altogether (we already have a bunch of nasty chemicals for that so I wouldn't think so)?

Out of ignorance these are the points that bother me in term of understanding the effectiveness of the study:

1 - do all ticks carry lyme?
2 - do all bites of lyme carrying ticks transfer the disease to the person?
3 - different people take different preventive measures before going in the woods, so that would affect the study as well and how?

To me the only effective way to actually inoculate the test subjects with lyme and see if they actually get the disease, but I guess we don't do these things any more?

Basically, you have no idea if you didn't get it because you were never exposed or because when exposed the vaccine did its job.

P.S. Wow that was an old post...oops!

Like any other vaccine study, just compare number of positive lyme cases in the test vs control groups. Difference needs to be significant usually at 95% confidence.
 
Like any other vaccine study, just compare number of positive lyme cases in the test vs control groups. Difference needs to be significant usually at 95% confidence.
I guess it all depends on how you get to the point where the vaccine is ready for testing, or in other words are these subjects the first ones to be tested with it?
 
Do you have Lyme?

no symptoms, just the bite.
they'll let me know in a few days - they'll do an assay on the biopsy. (I think that is the right term??)

I guess it all depends on how you get to the point where the vaccine is ready for testing, or in other words are these subjects the first ones to be tested with it?

first studies are the 'do no harm' ones ??
 
I'm due
With all the brush back this week I'm sure I'll be a winner.
I've gotten it every year now for past half dozen or more, 2023 has been looking good.
Probably just jinxed myself.
 
I guess it all depends on how you get to the point where the vaccine is ready for testing, or in other words are these subjects the first ones to be tested with it?

This is phase III:

Figure 1 Panel A and B_Page_1.png
 
P.S. Wow that was an old post...oops!
Yeah man, it was. Lol
Off the top of my head below


1 - do all ticks carry lyme?
No, but treat any tick like a loaded tick.
2 - do all bites of lyme carrying ticks transfer the disease to the person?
Nope. They need time to ingest and regurgitate your blood. (Yes, gross)
If you get a tick off you within 24 hrs, the likelihood of getting it is low per the CDC.
3 - different people take different preventive measures before going in the woods, so that would affect the study as well and how?
I dunno man, old post. Lol
 
1 - do all ticks carry lyme?
2 - do all bites of lyme carrying ticks transfer the disease to the person?
3 - different people take different preventive measures before going in the woods, so that would affect the study as well and how?

Veterinarian checking in to the thread again. Can't speak to human medicine, but for my patients the answers are thusly:


1) Only soft-shelled ticks. In this part of the world, that's the deer tick, Ixodes scapularis. Most recent prevalence I've seen is around 47% of deer ticks are carriers.

2) No. The Borrelia bacterium has to migrate from the body cavity to the salivary glands of the tick, which takes around 24 hours at common near-body temperatures. Most Lyme-carrying rocks will activate it on a bite but not all. Additionally, being bitten by a tick that later tests negative for Lyme doesn't mean you weren't bitten by another tock that had it - so tick-testing is probably of limited value.

3) Similar to the COVID vaccine trials, the point is to see how the vaccine does in a real-world environment. Thus: vaccinate a group of people and give another group a placebo, then wait. COVID had a very high prevalence so they reached significance really quickly. This may take longer, but the fact that it's volunteer- based means it's likely to draw people who are at a higher-than-average risk of exposure.

You're right that intentional inoculation would be more foolproof, but no ethics board would approve that. Also, that would introduce another variable - if they inoculate with one strain, we wouldn't know how it protects from other strains.


PSA: please make sure your dogs are protected from ticks and vaccinated. It's 2023, there's no reason for any dog to get Lyme disease. Oral preventatives are light-years ahead of anything topical.
 
Thanks for the heads-up !!!

This may take longer, but the fact that it's volunteer- based means it's likely to draw people who are at a higher-than-average risk of exposure.

They screened for people who are more likely to be exposed.
Some of the things which they asked.

have a large yard with woods on/nearby which i care for
have a pet that goes outside
work or recreate in the woods quite often
 
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