UST tire fix?

J-Dro

Well-Known Member
The other day I noticed my rear tire was totally flat after just sitting for a few days in the garage. It was fine a few days prior when I rode it last. It's a UST tire and I'm using Hutchinson goop in the tire for sealant. I pumped the tire back up and noticed a small amount of goop escaping from a gash in the tire about 1/8" long. After a few minutes, the liquid stopped coming through the gash, and the tire held pressure overnight. So, I figured that the sealant had done its job and filled the hole.

The tire held up well through the first half of a rocky ride at Sourlands, then suddenly lost all the air pressure. I used a tube to finish the ride, but now that I'm home I'm attempting to repair the tire again. The sealant doesn't seem to be working on its own this time. The liquid just keeps seeping through the hole but is not sealing it. Any advice or tricks of the trade? IMO, the tire gash doesn't seem that big that the tire should have to be trashed.
 

anrothar

entirely thrilled
you can sew it and then coat the stitches with a flexible epoxy of some sort if the goop doesn't seal it. but it should.
 

BiknBen

Well-Known Member
advice or tricks of the trade? IMO, the tire gash doesn't seem that big that the tire should have to be trashed.

The sealant is only good for sealing small punctures. You can put a boot on the inside of the tire. Park Tools and others sell adhesive patches that are larger and a little thicker than their glueless tube patches.

In a pinch, something like duct tape will work. Basically, you are looking for something that will adhere to the inside of the tire and stay in place but not expand through the hole under pressure.
 

J-Dro

Well-Known Member
The sealant is only good for sealing small punctures. You can put a boot on the inside of the tire. Park Tools and others sell adhesive patches that are larger and a little thicker than their glueless tube patches.

In a pinch, something like duct tape will work. Basically, you are looking for something that will adhere to the inside of the tire and stay in place but not expand through the hole under pressure.

Yeah I have a couple of those Park tire boots, but I wasn't sure how they would work with the sealant sloshing around inside. I guess you would have to clean and dry the area thoroughly before applying the boot.

But there is already an update... the tire has now started holding air again and the sealant stopped leaking out (well at least for the last 20 minutes). I still don't trust it on the trail though. I suspect that this 1/8" gash is probably at the upper limit of what the sealant should be expected to fix.
 

Maurice

New Member
Simply stick a patch from the inside, just like you would on a tubed tire. Assuming it's a UST tire. I'm not sure it would work on a regular tire, and I wouldn't trust a Stan's conversion anyway.
I know this works on hutchinson tires. Or you can use the "mushroom" type of repair, much like for a car tire you fold a little piece of rubber, coat it in cement and force it through the hole so that it seals it. The mushroom doesn't work too well when the puncture is around the bead, but otherwise holds just fine.

I've had tires with those types of repair hold for a long time.

Maurice
 

jdog

Shop: Halter's Cycles
Shop Keep
The fix..

The park tire boot won't hold up to the flex in a UST sidewall.


The only real fix is a tubeless specific patch kit. This kit uses super glue instead of rubber cement. This is not a super fun process but it is the only fix I would trust.

http://www.performancebike.com/shop/profile.cfm?SKU=16390


You must remove the tire and clean all the sealant off the inside.

Drop a few drops of superglue in both sides of the hole and apply the patch. Apply some pressure and wait for the glue to dry.

Put it all back together and go on living.

The reality is that the sealant most likely has worked for you many times on smaller holes but this hole was too much.

panaracer make a different fix that is more like a Auto tire plug. You stuff some material and a glue in the hole. I have not tried this type so I can't report a result.

On a side note it is important to know that while Stan's liquid latex gets much praise it will distroy many tires over time. I can't say why but stan's can break down the inner casing of the tire and cause it to fail. This usually results in a bubble or s-bend in the tire.

I know that Kenda and Hutchinson will NOT warranty any tire that shows use of Stan's. I am pretty sure than Maxxis and Hutchinson say the same.

Hutchinson IS working on a new sealant that should fill bigger holes. I hope to see this new sealant this summer.
 

J-Dro

Well-Known Member
J, Do you have those Hutchinson kits in stock?

BTW, this gash is NOT in the sidewall, its on the part of the tire that touches the ground, between the knobbies.

This gash almost seems too small to stuff a small piece of rubber into... unless of course I make the tear bigger. A patch on the inside of the tire seems like a better option in this case.
 

cem

Member
Hutchinson UST tire??

If its a Hutchinson UST tire, DON'T use sand paper to rough up the area around the gash for better glue adhesion, it will damage it.
 

J-Dro

Well-Known Member
If its a Hutchinson UST tire, DON'T use sand paper to rough up the area around the gash for better glue adhesion, it will damage it.

Ahh, Good to know since I'm running a Barracuda on the front. But the damaged tire is actually a Maxxis High Roller.
 

jdog

Shop: Halter's Cycles
Shop Keep
You could try and superglue a standard patch since I am pretty sure the patchs in the kit are the same.
 

Maurice

New Member
You could try and superglue a standard patch since I am pretty sure the patchs in the kit are the same.

Let me know if that works, and if yes it would be nice to share the steps involved. I've tried a few times with superglue but never had any luck. The rubber would harden on contact and it would fail. Don't know if it was because of the specific compound or what but I tried at least 2 different brands and several techniques (patch, directly in the hole).

It sounds like in your case the mushroom would be most appropriate since the hole is on the tread part. It's ok if the hole looks too small because that's going to keep the plug in better for the time it takes to cure. No need to sand anything, just clean it well, soak the plug in rubber cement and thread it in. The Panaracer kit comes with a big needle for that. Bonus: extra knob on the tire. It really sounds more complicated that it really is.

Cheers,

Maurice
 

pixychick

JORBA: Ringwood
JORBA.ORG
FWIW, Mr pixy repaired one for me with one of those kits, hole in the tread too, nevegal I believe. The plug was sticking out a tad and it dislodged on the first ride.
 

J-Dro

Well-Known Member
I've been thinking about the Superglue idea, and I just can't see regular old Superglue working permanently. It dries so brittle. Plus, when I looked at Superglue's web site, they say its compatible with just about every material known to mankind, but no mention of rubber. I suspect that Hutchinson is using a special kind of Superglue.

So I did some searching on mtbr and found that Loctite 380 Black Max has gotten really good reviews. Its a flexible glue specifically made to bond rubber. I'm going to pick up a tube tomorrow at Grainger's and try it out. $4 for a small tube.

http://www.loctite.com/int_henkel/loctite_us/index.cfm?&pageid=19&layout=3
 

jdog

Shop: Halter's Cycles
Shop Keep
J, Do you have those Hutchinson kits in stock?

BTW, this gash is NOT in the sidewall, its on the part of the tire that touches the ground, between the knobbies.

This gash almost seems too small to stuff a small piece of rubber into... unless of course I make the tear bigger. A patch on the inside of the tire seems like a better option in this case.

I have one of these for you jeffer.

J
 

cem

Member
loctite

back on the hutchenson tip... They recomend loctite 4850 to fix gashes 4mm long. I have not tried this nor do I even know were to get loctite 4850. But it might be another option to look into.
 

J-Dro

Well-Known Member
back on the hutchenson tip... They recomend loctite 4850 to fix gashes 4mm long. I have not tried this nor do I even know were to get loctite 4850. But it might be another option to look into.

From the google search that I did, it looks like Loctite 4850 is only available in Europe, Russia etc. My guess is that Loctite 380 is similar and perhaps more environmentally friendly. I pass by a Grainger store on my way to work so I'll pick up some 380 and experiment. Stay tuned...
 

ryderX

JORBA Luddite: KVSP Bulldog
JORBA.ORG
Jeff
How did the loctite work ? Did Graingers have it in stock ? Do you know the P.N. off hand ?
 

mtn_goat

Member
I had to repair a Specialized Eskar UST. It had a slice in the sidewall. I used the Hutchinson UST repair kit, just an oversized patch with similar glue. I got this at Pedal Sports in Oakland.

Just clean any sealant off of the sidewall, if you use sandpaper, do not rub to hard, or you will go to deep and remove the inner liner of the UST tire.

The patch never failed, the tire failed me in other ways prior to the patch failing.
 

J-Dro

Well-Known Member
Jeff
How did the loctite work ? Did Graingers have it in stock ? Do you know the P.N. off hand ?

Kris, I had mixed results... The loctite 'black max' was a bust when I tried to use it to hold a regular patch on the inside of the tire. It didn't hold at all. Frankly, I don't think it was designed for that. But, I squeezed a few drops into the slit in the tire from the outside and after a few minutes it seemed to hold air. It sets up pretty fast like superglue. I also patched the tire from the inside using regular old rubber cement and so far, so good.

I think the loctite could work on the trail as a temporary solution to avoid having to insert a tube as long as the gash isn't too big (maybe 1/8" or so). But I would still patch the tire from the inside when I got home for the long term.

Graingers does have this in stock, but they wouldn't sell it to me. They said it was considered 'hazardous material' and they could only sell it to a business that had a tax ID #. I couldn't quite make the connection how a tax ID # was going to save the environment from impending disaster from this 3 gram tube of loctite, but I found it at another distributer in Fairfield who was willing to sell it to me so I didn't bother to argue. You can probably use the W2 Sports account so most likely won't be a problem for you.

http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/items/3KE57
 
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