Salsa Mukluk Rear Hub / Freehub...are these teeth shot?

Karate Monkey

Well-Known Member
That ring is a loss anyway, could be dremel-ed out with a side cutting bit. Then you can assess if replaceable with the Novatec ring. I thought Salsa hubs were Formula though ?

This is one of those things you would need to do yourself. For what it would cost in labor/risk, you're better off paying a shop for a new hub/wheel.

You would need to use a diamond scribe to break the ring up if you were using a rotary tool, and you'd probably go through 1-2 bits (~$20).

dac1562fd19227b14acd6e07209d7a4c.jpg


It's just about as hard as you can make steel (so, like a bearing race, except probably case-hardened, since it would be cheaper than induction hardening just the teeth), so typical cutting tools don't do it. Unfortunately, since it is in aluminum, you'll never feel it when it gets close/through the driving ring, and a slip would do some good damage to the hub shell.

I know in some cases with problematic motorcycle/automotive bearing replacements, you can tack around the inside of the race, and the tendency for material to contract when cooled will make it come right out. 1) no idea if that holds true for threaded stuff, and 2) @Dave Taylor could probably tell you if it's even possible (but still not really worth paying someone to do).

I'm all for faffing around with something when I've got nothing better to do, but I typically subscribe to "am I wasting my time; am I wasting somebody else's money?"
 

Patrick

Overthinking the draft from the basement already
Staff member
@pygmypony i assume you have already decided this, but listening to @Patrick and trying to fix this is craziness. Think about it, are you really going to trust Pats fixes with the week he had last week?

i've already fixed the bike and the shoe.
even fixed the neighbor's snowblower.
i'm on fire.

and i wouldn't dremel it out - i'd figure a way to lever it with a bent screwdriver.
 
Last edited:

icebiker

JORBA: Morris Trails
JORBA.ORG
Coincidentally i have the pretty orange version with the little trees on it 😄I am running into a similar issue in my 2013 mukluk freehub, but my issue is not the forward pawl/tooth engagement but rather the a gritty feeling freehub when backpedaling. I am looking for a new freehub but am not sure which one to order. Jdog is helping me with Salsa but if I strike out, let me know if you decide to get a new and different hub and I’ll take the freehub off ya. Is your hub QR or TA?
 

CJS

New Member
Coincidentally i have the pretty orange version with the little trees on it 😄I am running into a similar issue in my 2013 mukluk freehub, but my issue is not the forward pawl/tooth engagement but rather the a gritty feeling freehub when backpedaling. I am looking for a new freehub but am not sure which one to order. Jdog is helping me with Salsa but if I strike out, let me know if you decide to get a new and different hub and I’ll take the freehub off ya. Is your hub QR or TA?
Will let you know! QR.
 

jdog

Shop: Halter's Cycles
Shop Keep
Many of the hubs are made by the formula hub company. (Not Formula Italy). It appears they make the majority of the low cost/ problematic hubs on the market. The major bike parts distributors don’t support the small parts for them. They unfortunately considered disposable and as Jim said, they cost like three dollars.

I’d encourage a rebuild w the old style dt hubs (not the new exp) , hope, onyx, or i9. If you have but one high end part on any bike, I’d argue that a rear hub is the one to have. The front almost doesn’t matter.
 

Steve Vai

Endurance Guy: Tolerates most of us.
Many of the hubs are made by the formula hub company. (Not Formula Italy). It appears they make the majority of the low cost/ problematic hubs on the market. The major bike parts distributors don’t support the small parts for them. They unfortunately considered disposable and as Jim said, they cost like three dollars.

I’d encourage a rebuild w the old style dt hubs (not the new exp) , hope, onyx, or i9. If you have but one high end part on any bike, I’d argue that a rear hub is the one to have. The front almost doesn’t matter.

They haven't upgraded the Big Ride to EXP yet. Hopefully the next round will see it.
 

jdog

Shop: Halter's Cycles
Shop Keep
They haven't upgraded the Big Ride to EXP yet. Hopefully the next round will see it.
I’m not sold on exp. We’ve had two that DT replaced for poor machining. Something I’ve never seen in the old style.
 

Steve Vai

Endurance Guy: Tolerates most of us.
I’m not sold on exp. We’ve had two that DT replaced for poor machining. Something I’ve never seen in the old style.

I like the little spring retainers. So far we've only done them on road wheels so they'll never break. I have to look at my Timberjack but those Rovals may be EXP also, they feel exactly the same.
 

serviceguy

Well-Known Member
This is one of those things you would need to do yourself. For what it would cost in labor/risk, you're better off paying a shop for a new hub/wheel.

You would need to use a diamond scribe to break the ring up if you were using a rotary tool, and you'd probably go through 1-2 bits (~$20).

dac1562fd19227b14acd6e07209d7a4c.jpg


It's just about as hard as you can make steel (so, like a bearing race, except probably case-hardened, since it would be cheaper than induction hardening just the teeth), so typical cutting tools don't do it. Unfortunately, since it is in aluminum, you'll never feel it when it gets close/through the driving ring, and a slip would do some good damage to the hub shell.

I know in some cases with problematic motorcycle/automotive bearing replacements, you can tack around the inside of the race, and the tendency for material to contract when cooled will make it come right out. 1) no idea if that holds true for threaded stuff, and 2) @Dave Taylor could probably tell you if it's even possible (but still not really worth paying someone to do).

I'm all for faffing around with something when I've got nothing better to do, but I typically subscribe to "am I wasting my time; am I wasting somebody else's money?"
I never had in mind economy or practicality on my comment, more like 'let's see if I can fix that'. Something I may attempt if the beautifully anodized red Salsa 2 (Formula) hubs on my el mariachi were to fail in a similar way. The bit I was thinking of is an actual Dremel that looks like a flat pointed drill bit, similar to what you would use on a bench mill, just smaller. It's specific for hardened material and as long as you keep temperature under control and take your time it has so far outlasted any diamond bit I've ever used.

With regard to the hardness of the material the fact that the ring is so badly worn out kind of speaks against it, I think.

I like the little spring retainers. So far we've only done them on road wheels so they'll never break. I have to look at my Timberjack but those Rovals may be EXP also, they feel exactly the same.

Does the EXP ratchet feel any different than the old ratchet? I know the difference in the design but I would have expected it wouldn't feel much different. Are the gear teeth cut differently?
 
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Steve Vai

Endurance Guy: Tolerates most of us.
I never had in mind economy or practicality on my comment, more like 'let's see if I can fix that'. Something I may attempt if the beautifully anodized red Salsa 2 (Formula) hubs on my el mariachi were to fail in a similar way. The bit I was thinking of is an actual Dremel that looks like a flat pointed drill bit, similar to what you would use on a bench mill, just smaller. It's specific for hardened material and as long as you keep temperature under control and take your time it has so far outlasted any diamond bit I've ever used.

With regard to the hardness of the material the fact that the ring is so badly worn out kind of speaks against it, I think.



Does the EXP ratchet feel any different than the old ratchet? I know the difference in the design but I would have expected it wouldn't feel much different. Are the gear teeth cut differently?

See my last sentence. They feel the same. Or, I should rephrase that. They feel the same depending on which ratchet you have installed. The EXP has a slightly more snappy engagement because it uses 2 spring guides and the tension is like 5% greater.
 

serviceguy

Well-Known Member
See my last sentence. They feel the same. Or, I should rephrase that. They feel the same depending on which ratchet you have installed. The EXP has a slightly more snappy engagement because it uses 2 spring guides and the tension is like 5% greater.
Thanks. I thought you were hinting to the Rovals possibly being EXP because they felt exactly like the EXP so I ASSumed they felt different from the old ones. The two springs in the regular ratchet do feel flimsy, I wonder if they need to be in order to reduce wear on the ratcheting rings (they did limit the rings to 36T in the EXP if I remember correctly, and I believe you pointed out the 54T upgrade being prone to failure in the past).
 

Steve Vai

Endurance Guy: Tolerates most of us.
The new Rovals are EXP. I'm running the Control SLs (EXP) on my Timberjack. The CLX50s on my Tarmac, the CL38s on my Stormchaser, the spare set of Crest MK3s, and my geared wherlset for Rusty are all the standard star-ratchets.
 

serviceguy

Well-Known Member
The new Rovals are EXP. I'm running the Control SLs (EXP) on my Timberjack. The CLX50s on my Tarmac, the CL38s on my Stormchaser, the spare set of Crest MK3s, and my geared wherlset for Rusty are all the standard star-ratchets.
Is there any specific reason to run Roval rather than DT Swiss ? Since I believe DT Swiss makes them, are they any different/better that the DT Swiss branded one?
 
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