Q for managers/bosses.


entirely thrilled
i have a question for any of the managers/bosses/employers out there in mtbnjland.

job: physical labor, often fast paced, sometimes slow.

you have two employees(out of many).

#1 is a 65 year old man, overweight, very knowledgable about several aspects of the field, very experienced. a little slower than some due to age, but methodical, safe, and competent. he's been working for you for 6 years. he's got the mentality of a typical long time blue collar worker, proud, stubborn, bit of a temper, maybe feels a little scorned that he never made manager.

#2 is the son of #1. 30 years old, very athletic. learns quickly, moves quickly, is agile, smart, and, well, quick. he's been working for you for 3 years. inherited the proud and stubborn traits from father, but is patient and doesn't complain.

would you consider putting them in the same vehicle all day long(permanently) with the son in charge of the father? not by request mind you, it would be entirely your idea with no input from them.
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JORBA Board Member/Chapter Leader
after working in a family business (my dad's hardware store) for years and being the son trying to take it over... i would advise against it if there is another way to schedule the folks working for you.

family and business generally don't mix for long periods of time.


Former Resident Nerd
I've spent 17+ years managing mostly engineers (and other managers), so certainly take what I say w/a bit of a grain of salt. I haven't managed any blue collar positions since I was the assistant manager at a bus depot in my late teens.

My knee-jerk reaction would be to find another solution if there is one. But...

It is impossible to answer this without actually knowing the two men. Here is some food for thought:

- What is the reason you want to put junior in charge? And more importantly, is the potential risk of conflict & problems worth whatever junior brings to the table if he is in charge.

- What is dad's ego like? Would he take this as a slap in the face? Or is he old 'n salty and doesn't really give a flyin' f*** about such things ("hell, I don't give a sh!t as long as I get paid").

- Is dad proud of junior? Would dad be proud of junior as this could be viewed as a "taking of the reigns"? This could be a way to position it if you have no alternative and have good reason to put junior in charge.

- Does junior respect boundaries wrt his dad? In other words, is junior the kind of guy that would make demands of his dad he wouldn't with somebody else. Or, conversely, is he "professional" enough to not to let dad slack?

- Is dad the kind of guy who is "professional" enough to respect junior's authority?

- Have you seen them work together before? Was the dynamic a good one? Or was it like Orange Co. Choppers (albeit the Tuetels relationship on camera is contrived, I think).

- If you do it, and it doesn't work, what is your plan "B"? And as I eluded to earlier, why is it better for this to be plan "B" than plan "A".

Anyway, think about what I've tossed out there in the context of these men and, if you know them fairly well, follow your instincts...you'll probably be right.

The Kalmyk

Well-Known Member
What kind of relationship do the father and son have....While the father may be scorned for not being considered for a manager position he may love the fact that his son was given the opportunity or vice versa....


entirely thrilled
father can and will take instruction, but does not respond well to being given orders that don't make sense to him, if that makes any sense. tends to be judgemental. like just about everyone else from age 14 on, he thinks he knows everything. i really don't see any other option here.

possible negatives i see:

father will resent son's mobility and energy, and it reflects on his lack there-of. son might end up feeling the same vice versa.

son will feel awkward giving orders to father, or criticizing his work. would the son really be in charge? or would he yield to the familial authority of his father?

father will be resistant to son's new and different methods, preferring the way he's been doing it for years.

son will move to fast for the father, father would move to slow for the son. either son will have to work his ass off to pick up the slack(further adding to the fathers resentment of his mobility/energy), or will slow down to take it easy on his father and we'll lose productivity.

the father took the job in retirement, so there would be no passing on of the torch or anything like that here. son definitely has future management potential, father doesn't seem interested in management, but isn't one to say, "hell, I don't give a sh!t as long as I get paid".

father got the son the job. not sure how that would play into it.

The Kalmyk

Well-Known Member
Tough one here.....Keep them together and be consistant on getting feedback from them on the positives and negatives of working together....Weekly follow ups and taking the time to listen to their concerns will assist in finding patterns....You also pointed out something very important here Sean....One will work faster than the other simply because of age....The key to all smooth running operations is to have the right people in the right places....I am not suggesting to fire the old man but can his attention to detail be helpful somewhere else


entirely thrilled
appreciate the help fellas. i really just wanted to verify my boss's incompetance. i'm the son(i'm 31, but was 30 when they stuck us together.). there is absolutely no attempt at communication by my boss. a job that i enjoyed has sucked for the past 5 or so months, and my productivity has dropped significantly. when she first announced she was doing this, my immediate thought was that she was trying to get my father to quit, and being a complete ***** about it. it's sure gonna stick it to her when i'm the one that quits later this month. yukon ho!


Well-Known Member
Hi Ho Silver?

Im sure thats going to be a bomb from no where. As long as dad doesnt end up w/ the short end of the stick. GL!


Mayor McCheese
Team MTBNJ Halter's
Oh snap! It was a game! It's like that time you shaved your beard and gave us hints. *sigh*...I'm going to miss these word jumbles.


Mayor McCheese
Team MTBNJ Halter's
Actually I'm curious as to what your dad says about the situation.

The Kalmyk

Well-Known Member
there is absolutely no attempt at communication by my boss. a job that i enjoyed has sucked for the past 5 or so months, and my productivity has dropped significantly.QUOTE]

Fuck that bitch....Nothing worst when bosses cant be straight up....She has no ballz:)....


Love Drunk
Jerk Squad
I agree that they were probably getting your dad to quit. I work in an engineering office and we hired a project manager in his 40's. From the interview we thought he was going to be a hard ass manager and whip people into shape. From the first day he started he clashed with upper management and was quickly written off. After a year of doing bs work, they put him out in the field with a 28 year old as the lead and cut his pay by 25%. At first he was pissed but then realized he was getting paid damn well to do easy work. He leached for another year and a half and then they fired him. Best of all, I had to to manage this dysfunctional field crew....


Former Resident Nerd
.... it's sure gonna stick it to her when i'm the one that quits later this month. yukon ho!

Gah! You're sticking it to ME!

My town is loosing a good employee and, thusly, the value of my tax dollar is getting even more diluted :getsome:


Strong like bull, smart like tractor
Team MTBNJ Halter's
i've managed a few people in my time and i can tell you that i'd never do that. there is a very limited upside and a huge downside, both to the employees and the company. now if it were you, and, say your close in age cousin/brother, different story.

IMHO there's no way she should have done that. good luck with this sean. it's a sticky situation fo' shizzle.


Fourth Party
As a fellow union member, I would first look into your contract to see if there is any language about your situation. Your boss may be creating something that does not fly as per union/employer agreements. I dont know if Township/County workers have an actual contract, but there has to be something somewhere that can be presented to look over. Do you have a shop steward you can speak to, they may be able to shed some light.

Not So Fast

Have a fall back

I don't think I would ever want to put a father/son team together, with the son being the boss. It most certainly smells like a set up for the old man. To arrange a partnership without consulting the father/son team just doesnt make sense to me.

When you leave I hope you have a job waiting for you. If not ask for a reassignment.

Good Luck


entirely thrilled
i'm leaving to move to alaska. i was offered several jobs while up there on vacation, so shouldn't have trouble finding work. they would be really stupid to get rid of my father, he's the only one in the dept with a pesticide liscence, the only one who knows anything about trees(and he knows everything about them), and has more experience and knowhow with a chainsaw than all the rest of the department combined. but stupidity is par for the course with my employer, so i should only expect as much. between myself and him, they would lose all the employees with any kind of applicable, and required, certifications.

if anyone is looking for a job with high relative pay, excellent bennies, and advancement opportunities, and doesn't mind working with and for complete idiots in an environment where stupidity and incompetance seem to be rewarded, lemme know, i'll recommend you when i leave.
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