Norm and Utah...Dot the right Thing!

Sevenz

Well-Known Member
I get that you are all friends but you have to look at it from an "outsiders" perspective...Yeah, the piece he missed was small and they did win by a lot...But who knows...If he did that section maybe he would have gotten a flat or crashed or one of the many other things that can happen in a race...And I did listen to norms podcast this morning when he calls out the other team for cutting the course and they did get DQ'ed..Yeah they did cut more than him but hey in my book cutting the course is cutting the course no matter how long or short...Like I said the only resolution is DQ in my book!!! Dark Horse missed the boat on this one! LAME
 

bonefishjake

Strong like bull, smart like tractor
Team MTBNJ Halter's
I get that you are all friends but you have to look at it from an "outsiders" perspective...Yeah, the piece he missed was small and they did win by a lot...But who knows...If he did that section maybe he would have gotten a flat or crashed or one of the many other things that can happen in a race...And I did listen to norms podcast this morning when he calls out the other team for cutting the course and they did get DQ'ed..Yeah they did cut more than him but hey in my book cutting the course is cutting the course no matter how long or short...Like I said the only resolution is DQ in my book!!! Dark Horse missed the boat on this one! LAME

you forgot eaten by a bear.

you're right, we are all friends but we are also our own toughest critics.

the guys who put on the race have chimed in...so i'm not sure what more can be done to edify you at this point.
 

maddawg

Member
I get that you are all friends but you have to look at it from an "outsiders" perspective...Yeah, the piece he missed was small and they did win by a lot...But who knows...If he did that section maybe he would have gotten a flat or crashed or one of the many other things that can happen in a race...And I did listen to norms podcast this morning when he calls out the other team for cutting the course and they did get DQ'ed..Yeah they did cut more than him but hey in my book cutting the course is cutting the course no matter how long or short...Like I said the only resolution is DQ in my book!!! Dark Horse missed the boat on this one! LAME

i understand your point. i made the call.
the other teams came thru with 14 miles on the first lap. that just can't be undone.
norm's gps was pretty close even though he said he thought he missed a piece.
i let the race play out and made a worse case call with time and so forth.
it was my call.
doesn't matter that he is a friend. would have made the same call otherwise.
although i doubt if many people in that situation would have even questioned the length of their lap let alone brought it to the attention of the promoter.

i am sure that this doesn't make you feel any better. for that i apologize.
hopefully you enjoyed the race, the atmosphere, the bbq, and getting together with 400 like minded people for a day of riding bikes.
i know that for me personally that what really matters.
 

Ofar

New Member
dude, don't say you don't care. you do. it's blatantly obvious in this post.

Really? We're a bunch of grown men wearing tights(one guy was even wearing a dress), riding around on bicycles. If you take this seriously you probably have mental issues. Believe me when I say, "I really don't care". It's all about having a good time & that's exactly what happened yesterday.
 

Pearl

THIS CHANGES EVERYTHING
Really? We're a bunch of grown men wearing tights(one guy was even wearing a dress)

i can confirm this fellow.

I lined up next to this guy and was glad I at least beat him. Then I realized he wasn't in my class :mad:
 

UtahJoe

Team Workhorse
Team MTBNJ Halter's
I of course didnt know about Norm missing that section until the end of the race. By then he had already told Mike about it. Like mike said, it was his call. I wouldn't have complained if he decided to dnf us. With regards to the other guys...they missed a turn and 6-7miles of the course, not 5min. But your point is valid Sevenz, anything could have happened.

I do feel partly responsible as I told norm you come out of campground and make a left since I got to pre ride it and he didnt. I forgot about the right and that added loop.
 

extremedave

Well-Known Member
Team MTBNJ Halter's
Really? We're a bunch of grown men wearing tights(one guy was even wearing a dress), riding around on bicycles. If you take this seriously you probably have mental issues. Believe me when I say, "I really don't care". It's all about having a good time & that's exactly what happened yesterday.

You've posted once (ever) in the winter and four times this thread. I think you care a little.
 

Sevenz

Well-Known Member
Utah...I appreciate that you get the point and I get that Dark Horse made the decision to let it stick...Although I don't agree with it...It is what it is I guess...

Just like most of you the outcome does not have any effect on my placement in the race...I raced elite open...The only reason I looked into it is good friends of my placed 3rd in the team cat and they mentioned that Norm came out of the woods on the first lap before me...I know I was not passed by anyone wearing an MTBNJ kit in the first lap...I looked into it and it was pretty obvious...

Hey Congratz on the Win!
 

bonefishjake

Strong like bull, smart like tractor
Team MTBNJ Halter's
Really? We're a bunch of grown men wearing tights(one guy was even wearing a dress), riding around on bicycles. If you take this seriously you probably have mental issues. Believe me when I say, "I really don't care". It's all about having a good time & that's exactly what happened yesterday.

dude, you clearly don't know me. at all. otherwise you'd understand how absurd this statement is when you're calling out a guy (me) who routinely refers to what he rides in as a matchy-matchy ballerina outfit.

i like hoboken though.
 

soulchild

Well-Known Member
matchy-matchy ballerina outfit

ace%2Bventura%2Btutu.JPG
 

Kirt

JORBA: Chimney Rock, Team MTBNJ.COM
JORBA.ORG
Team MTBNJ Halter's
I'll chime in. I was part of the 2nd place team, also am a teammate of Norm & Utah & more importantly a friend to both of them. But I'll say I couldn't disagree more with the decision. It completely goes against the spirit of MTN racing. It should have been so black & white, the course was cut it should have been a DQ. Just because he was so far ahead should have played NO role in the decision. As others have said & we all know anything can happen in a MTN bike race. Ask the team that was in 2nd place & had a derailleur explode for no apparent reason with 4 miles to go. If we are going to base it on how far ahead he was we could have just decided not to race at all & award them 1st place based on how far & away faster they are than myself & Chris. But again this is mtn bike racing, were we actually line up against many that are faster than us, race our bikes & see who survives & finishes the the whole course 1st & it just shouldn't have played out like this. Yes in the end it's about having a great time & I did, actually had a great time, I just wanted to state my opinion.
 

Sevenz

Well-Known Member
Right on Bro!!! This is my exact point!

I'll chime in. I was part of the 2nd place team, also am a teammate of Norm & Utah & more importantly a friend to both of them. But I'll say I couldn't disagree more with the decision. It completely goes against the spirit of MTN racing. It should have been so black & white, the course was cut it should have been a DQ. Just because he was so far ahead should have played NO role in the decision. As others have said & we all know anything can happen in a MTN bike race. Ask the team that was in 2nd place & had a derailleur explode for no apparent reason with 4 miles to go. If we are going to base it on how far ahead he was we could have just decided not to race at all & award them 1st place based on how far & away faster they are than myself & Chris. But again this is mtn bike racing, were we actually line up against many that are faster than us, race our bikes & see who survives & finishes the the whole course 1st & it just shouldn't have played out like this. Yes in the end it's about having a great time & I did, actually had a great time, I just wanted to state my opinion.
 

ChrisRU

Well-Known Member
I'm not going to chime in anymore on either side of the issue, but will say that the time and place for this to be handled is at the race, not the day after. It seems clear that there was some suspicion yesterday, so that should have been brought to the attention of the scoring team/race promoter within a timely fashion of results being posted- this is the standard at ALL races, sanctioned or not. After that, the window is closed. In this scenario, the promoter was made aware of the situation on race day and it was resolved. The outcome is certainly debatable and its an unfortunate situation that I'm sure all involved would rather not have to deal with- but its done, results are finalized.

Scoring and running races is difficult, especially when racers want results as quickly as possible. Sometimes judgement calls have to made quickly. It seems like Darkhorse had another home run event overall.
 
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THATmanMANNY

Well-Known Member
ya'll bunch of clowns
try a real man's endurance race then you'll earn the right to be keyboard nazis
:wedgie:
 

bonefishjake

Strong like bull, smart like tractor
Team MTBNJ Halter's
look, we can debate this all day. about 1/2 are going to fall into one camp, 1/2 the other. 100% will never be happy.

the point is, and the the topic of this thread, is that norm did the right thing and did so fairly immediately. the promoter chimed in and confirmed as much. there's nothing further to debate here.

can we just put an asterisk next to their names and move on?
 
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