My hartshorne and Huber Woods Park pictures

mr.chainsaw said:
My GPS I parked in the upper lot. I like to park at Buttermilk FTR
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i park in rocky point because its so easy to get to every trail in the park from there. its a no brainer. why would i park there and ride a mile or so just to get on grandtour or rocky point
 
Buttermilk is right at the bottom of Grand Tour. You can go left and head up the fire road or go right and climb up the water bars. Either one works
 
I always park at buttermilk lot, and usually take the fire road to grand tour; works as a good warm up.

If your use to parking at the other lot, this might be a nice way to mix it up to make some gains, since you get to the technical trails after your already a little tired... I do the same thing when I park at buttermilk and go to the right, up the waterbars, that way by the time I get to rocky point I'm more tired than usual.

The main difference though is that rocky point lot starts with a decent, and buttermilk starts with a climb.
 
whenever i do park at buttermilk i always go left. if i ride tommrow i think ill ride right and check it out
 
Rode Hartshorne for the first time in probably a year while I had a short break in the day and parked in the Buttermilk lot like I always have. Rocky Point is at least another 5 minutes drive each way and I've been going to the Buttermilk lot since I started riding there in the early 90's. I like popping in and going right up Laurel Ridge and working my way to the riverside and then back.

Trails were over all pretty good. I think Hartshorne does a little better with it being so dry. Those harsh downpours make short work out of blowing out the type of trail and soil over there.

I liked the re-routes that I found - one being in the Monmouth Hills area of Grand Tour. I remember a group working that area at a TM last fall but never got to sample it until today. As much as I liked to open it up on the old top section with the berms and small jumps - the new trail felt a lot smoother and more flowy. The work further on Grand Tour seems to be holding well - that patch work with the big stones looks like it's holding up well and gives a bit more grip. On the one hand it could be nice to take some fall-line out of it but with some armoring, it could stay as is - a good steep climb/decent.

The re-route up near the water tower on Grand Tour is sooo much nicer than that other mess that was there. Both of the new routes could use a little more shelf/bench cut but hopefully natural use will provide that.

The work on Laurel Ridge seems to be holding up ok from the spring TM but those log water bars are annoying as hell and look to contribute more damage than good. The drains that Poor Iggy and a few of us worked on seems to be working nicely - I can see that a bunch of water was dumping out from them. Hopefully next time it rains I can pop in and see how the water is flowing.

There were a few parts that absolutely need some love. Two different sections of Laurel Ridge that come near Hartshorne Road are just beat to sh1t and need a major fix or better yet some re-routing. And then there are 2 sections on Grand Tour that are just as bad - just after that new re-route going downhill - that section is total proof that fall lines and water bars create f'd up trail. Then the section near the Command Loop that links to Cuesta Ridge is another mess. I think there are 3 different lanes on that climb/decent. Road it both ways and it sucked each way.

Hopefully we can get some more TM's over there. I know I missed the last one but if they were more frequent we could get that place running good. Pick away and fix those sections well and the place would be amazing.
 
mr.chainsaw said:
you'll hit mini Devil"s Elbow...with the tree thats off camber about half way up just before the "turn of doom"
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I think I know where you are talking about but never heard those names. Devil's Elbow is a little tricky but nothing like that old route was. IDK, I think the Turn of Doom has gotten better over the years. Seems like it opens up little by little from the elements and use.

Looks like someone keeps putting rocks on the outside of that trail - which is very cool. I like how it frames it out.
 
the fire road hill is a disaster waiting to happen!!! there are some HUUUUGE gullies in the middle of the road. in at least two places they are right behind the downhill side of the waterbars. it's just a matter of time before someone comes bombing down that hill (and you can go REALLY FAST) and gets a front wheel jammed...just a matter of time.
 
"mini devils elbow" - funny. I assume you speak of the switch-back hill going counterclockwise on Laurel Ridge?

observations on that hill:

(1) it's gotten a little harder lately since the hill above the big turn is all eroded. used to be when you cleared the turn it was basically clear sailing. now there's like 30 feet of eroded crap to get over.

(2) with that said, it's not 1/2 as hard as the real devils elbow. just not nearly as steep.

(3) it's really not a hard hill. the sand/root/logs/steep hill going clockwise on Laurel Ridge is REALLY hard...hardest in park (much harder than Devil's Elbow) followed by the trail to the left of the Fire Road hill (it's steep and has step-after-step-after-step-after-log-after-log-after step). challenging hill...hate that hill.
 
wonderturtle said:
(3) it's really not a hard hill. the sand/root/logs/steep hill going clockwise on Laurel Ridge is REALLY hard...hardest in park (much harder than Devil's Elbow) followed by the trail to the left of the Fire Road hill (it's steep and has step-after-step-after-step-after-log-after-log-after step). challenging hill...hate that hill.
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I dunno WT Devils Elbow is pretty tough for me. Though I guess that could be because my bike is pretty slack at 67 or so degree's while I'd say I can clear the Laurel Ridge 80% of the time.
 
wonderturtle said:
the fire road hill is a disaster waiting to happen!!! there are some HUUUUGE gullies in the middle of the road. in at least two places they are right behind the downhill side of the waterbars. it's just a matter of time before someone comes bombing down that hill (and you can go REALLY FAST) and gets a front wheel jammed...just a matter of time.
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wonderturtle said:
"mini devils elbow" - funny. I assume you speak of the switch-back hill going counterclockwise on Laurel Ridge?

observations on that hill:

(1) it's gotten a little harder lately since the hill above the big turn is all eroded. used to be when you cleared the turn it was basically clear sailing. now there's like 30 feet of eroded crap to get over.

(2) with that said, it's not 1/2 as hard as the real devils elbow. just not nearly as steep.

(3) it's really not a hard hill. the sand/root/logs/steep hill going clockwise on Laurel Ridge is REALLY hard...hardest in park (much harder than Devil's Elbow) followed by the trail to the left of the Fire Road hill (it's steep and has step-after-step-after-step-after-log-after-log-after step). challenging hill...hate that hill.
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I wasn't thinking of the fire road but agree. There could be a nice ribbon of singletrack that runs parrallel to the fireroad which could slow down the speed but I get off focus (there are more areas that need work more desperately).

After riding those trails on your point #3 downhill the other day, I feel someone is going to get f'd up badly. I'm sure I've said it before, I love tech stuff as much as the next guy but those sections are torn to hell.

BTW, where is the main Devil's Elbow?
 
wonderturtle said:
"mini devils elbow" - funny. I assume you speak of the switch-back hill going counterclockwise on Laurel Ridge?

observations on that hill:

(1) it's gotten a little harder lately since the hill above the big turn is all eroded. used to be when you cleared the turn it was basically clear sailing. now there's like 30 feet of eroded crap to get over.

(2) with that said, it's not 1/2 as hard as the real devils elbow. just not nearly as steep.

(3) it's really not a hard hill. the sand/root/logs/steep hill going clockwise on Laurel Ridge is REALLY hard...hardest in park (much harder than Devil's Elbow) followed by the trail to the left of the Fire Road hill (it's steep and has step-after-step-after-step-after-log-after-log-after step). challenging hill...hate that hill.
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i think ill give that section your talking about a visit today if my mom gives me back my wheel........
 
don - the "real" Devils Elbow is on the Rocky Point trail. it has a nearly 180-degree turn at the mid-point after which is gets progressively steeper. its a nice challenge.

yeah about the fire road - those ruts are going to claim a victim. you dont expect a 2-foot deep canyon in the middle of a fire road and they kinda blend in (some are right behind the water bars) so I could totally see someone not seeing them and dipping their front wheel in there. with the speeds you get get on that hill....bad news!!!
 
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wonderturtle said:
don - the "real" Devils Elbow is on the Rocky Point trail. it has a nearly 180-degree turn at the mid-point after which is gets progressively steeper. its a nice challenge.
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thats the OG one... the other one is right out the buttermilk lot, it has the off camber tree across it
 
Actually I've always had a problem desending devils elbow. I think its all in my head but I can't seem to make that turn. I've tried kicking out my rear wheel to the right but it it is banked up so the ground it self prevents me from doin that. There is just so much going on in that turn between chiseled out erosion, bank up to the out side while going down hill at 180 degrees my mind and body has hard time processing what to do and I can't pick a line.

The only time I ever came close to clearing it while desending was the first time I tried because I didn't know it was there so I just did it. Ever since then its been a mental thing. Now that i think about it I've had the same probalbe with the "mini devils elbow" too.

If anyone has any tips on decending please provide some insight!
 
I find that taking those turns wide then turning my front tire & leaning my upper body down the fall line seems to do the trick. Work with gravity, let it flow.

Practice it slow, once you have it down you can do it faster.
 
Ride On said:
Actually I've always had a problem desending devils elbow. I think its all in my head but I can't seem to make that turn. I've tried kicking out my rear wheel to the right but it it is banked up so the ground it self prevents me from doin that. There is just so much going on in that turn between chiseled out erosion, bank up to the out side while going down hill at 180 degrees my mind and body has hard time processing what to do and I can't pick a line.

The only time I ever came close to clearing it while desending was the first time I tried because I didn't know it was there so I just did it. Ever since then its been a mental thing. Now that i think about it I've had the same probalbe with the "mini devils elbow" too.

If anyone has any tips on decending please provide some insight!
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Just take it slow and easy!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F_1i9Y7yOFo
 
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