Saw that same post, I'm using that 1/2 and 1/2 mix now. Seemed to work well in a race I did on Saturday. After 10,000 feet of climbing, I had no leg cramps, which can be a common problem for me if I don't drink constantly.
Jess is right... I see it listed as a primary ingredient Clif Shots, Gu, HammerGel, Heed, etc.
I just bought a tub of it through Ebay. I read some of the product placement articles on ride424.com and the guy Steve [Something] (of Hammer Nutrition) talks about it in one article. Hopefully I get it before Sunday so I can test it out this weekend on the road (much more controlled setting for new product testing).
Will do. Curious as to where you read the initial post that mergs talked about. I posted on the mtbr-nj forums and ryderxx/rryyddeerr suggested the same thing. I hadn't given it much thought (the idea of essentially making my own drink) until recently. But really, why not?
I'm not sure if I'll mix it with Gatorade or Accelerade. Probably the later since that's what I normally use.
i have been corresponding w/ noah (rryyddeerr) after i read his response to your post on mtbr. considering he was the only one who was using this cocktail, i figured i would try to get some additional opinions here. i started using cytomax for pre-ride hydration, and recovery w/endurox, but will try noah/mergs gatorade/malto mix for pre- and during-ride hydration.
Given that you're in the same maltodextrin boat I am, you'd probably be interested in my post-ride foods which I've recently gotten to work for me. I subscribe to the idea of ingesting 1g carb/lb body weight after riding. My current array is 3 scoops Endurox, a cup of grape nuts with a cup of rice milk, and a plain bagel. This gets me fat/carb/protein numbers of 8/215/31. More carbs than I need, per se. But it sticks to the 4:1-7:1 carbrotein ratio that I've read about, with a little fat in there for good measure, which some sources say is also good. I use rice milk because it's a much higher GI food than regular milk. I only use it for post or pre ride meals though.
The real proof (for me obviously) is that my muscles are almost never sore the day after I ride. Don't get me wrong, they're still a little tight some days. But I used to burn walking up the subway steps on Wednesday from a Sunday ride. This was a week before I started to really be vigilant in getting the recovery food in a certain time frame (I shoot for 45 minutes after end of riding).
I don't think products like Endurox/etc are necessary at all. But they help deliver the calories you need in a tastier way than, say, eating 4 plain bagels after a ride. So for that they're well worth it.
i have also been using www.fitday.com and you are right, it should be www.fullfooddisclosre.com. The charts are very useful in determing the fat/carb/prot ratios. It's not so obvious, but i've already shed 6 lbs since i started tracking. only 15 more to go...
So you must be mtnbkr0101? It's a great site. I haven't lost any weight but I'm not trying to lose weight right now. I could drop some pounds to be sure. But with the 24 Allamuchy race coming up I don't want to focus on weight loss only to get weaker on the bike. As it is, I'm already far too weak on the bike. But it has certainly made maintaining my weight a lot easier, especially since I really do plow down the carbs like that after every ride. My focus right now is making every training ride count, so I don't pull 2 laps at Allamuchy then go for the beer. I like beer.
mtnbkr0101 - that would be me. unfortunately, i packed on MEGA weight after our daughter was born last november and i stopped working in NYC (i didn't realize that walking those 50+ blocks a day helped my metabolism so much). these lfestyle changes, coupled with the crummy weather (i know, excuses) made for a dismal riding season for me this year.
i did 24 of mooch in '02 an '03, and it was a blast. that will be my goal for next year...
beer after 2 laps is not necessarily a bad thing - good source of carbs and dulls the pain! good luck with the race - you going solo?
Interesting. We had a daughter in April. I still work in NYC. The commute provides me with solid time every day where I don't actually eat. Otherwise I'm constantly munching on something.
I am going solo, which is questionable decision considering my longest ride this year is currently about 3 hours. I'm not riding the whole time - we chose solo because our team from last year looks to have disinegrated and the remaining members want to ride together. I'm still not sure how to play it, since the real goal of the "season" is the All-A-Muchy in mid-October. I may do 4 straight laps at moderate pace (assuming I can) then go to bed and maybe do 1-2 the next day if my oh-so-great post ride food plan has me up for it.
Just an update. After 7 days, I still have not gotten my maltodextrin. This guy is supposed to be in Middlesex, NJ, which is about 20 miles from my house. I'm hoping to be able to use it this weekend because, you know, I'm an idiot and I want to change up my bike nutrition 2 weeks before the 24 hour ride.
Took out 2 bottles for yesterday's recovery ride of about 20 miles (on the road). Didn't plan on drinking them both, but wanted to overdo it to see how much I could stomach in a short time. I used an entire do-it-yourself mix:
Added this all to a 32 oz Nalgene bottle, added about 16 oz of water, and shook it. And shook it. And shook it. The little white blobs of maltodextrin mix very reluctantly. After a few rounds of shake, then do something, it was finally mixed.
I divided it into 2 water bottles, then topped them off. Roughly 48 ounces of water.
So I find myself thinking in terms of limiters these days, identifying rides in terms of the 1 thing that held me back the most (almost always short & steep climbs). In terms of this concoction, there was 1 clear limiter. Taste. The mango kool-aid was designed for 64 ounces of water, and a whole botaload of sugar. As a result, this mixture was bitter, not sweet. The lack of sweetness is something I could probably get used to. The bitterness, not so easily. I have a few other kool-aid packs. Obviously I need to use less kool-aid, and maybe another flavor, fruit punch or something classic like that. Am I old if I refer to Fruit Punch Kool-Aid as a classic?
I knocked out 1 bottle in about 45 minutes, which is a fair calorie intake (220 per hour pace). The stomach was fine with it, no adverse reactions. But the taste...it wasn't awful but it wasn't something I enjoyed much. That clearly needs work.
In terms of energy I never felt weak, which would happen at the end of a 20 mile ride had I brought nothing. But this clearly isn't a true test of anything. I need to work out the details of the mix. I know some mix it with Gatorade but I'm trying to avoid simple sugars with this mix...I really don't know why. I note that Hammer uses some sort of apple concentrate for sweetness. Perhaps I should just toss in some table sugar.
At some point this weekend I will more than likely fall back to a maltodextrin mix. Despite the fact that every intelligible source says to not try anything new on race day, I'm an idiot. As such, I will likely follow up this post with colorful vomit stories. Stay tuned.
kool aid, huh? i have been using ll gatorade at the proprtions originally posted, and the taste is ok. I picked up a drink container from vitamin shop - looks like an oversized water bottle, with a mixing disk on to - a plastic ring with fins, which helps in the mixing process, and it is working ok.
i can't get my act together to just "shut up and ride", but am looking to get a road bike at the end of summer, and then take a more regimented approach to seeing how well this stuff works.
Trying kool-aid because it's used in the do-it-yourself Gatorade instructions I've found on various sites. A lot of salt because I am a sweat hog and need to replace it, so I need to get used to that taste. Emergen-C at the recommendation of theferralkid on the other board. I should just cut it with Accelerade or Gatorade and go from there.
After this weekend I'm done with Accelerade and Gatorade for these long distance rides. I was rotating drinks on each lap and on the 4th lap, I was back to Accelerade, full strength. It was like drinking nuclear sugar. I couldn't believe it was normal strength. At the rest stop I drank as much as I could and topped it off with the free Heed they were giving out. Full strength Heed tastes like lightly flavored water.
Only did 1 lap the next day but just dumped pure maltodextrin in the bottle and added water. I've noticed that the mixing problems go away if you just let it sit there for a few minutes. The toned down sweetness makes it a lot easier to continue to drink. I may keep using a hint of Accelerade or Gatorade for a light flavor. But as a primary fuel source I'm done with it.
Now I need to find the cheapest source of maltodextrin.
I recently started using Hammer HEED religiously for 2.5 hr rides and under. Anything over 2.5hrs I have been using Perpetuem and it's great. Unlike Gatorade and others there are no simple sugars in their drinks so you don't spike your energy levels. I used Perpetuem for the 24hrs of Allamuchy and the stuff may not be the best tasting for everyone but I swear by their products and it uses the 4:1 ratio. Heed is not a super sweet over powering electrolyte drink either, very smooth and have never had GI issues or any stomach cramping after 1 yeasr use of the stuff. Anyone else try their products?