Illegal trails off the top of Tourne.

Berms&Boofs

Well-Known Member
After many years without an issue some riders are making their own unsanctioned downhill lines from the top of Tourne again. The land manager is not happy about this and the significant erosion it is creating. This line will likely will be fenced off again shortly.

Please help spread the word to stay off this unsanctioned downhill fall line trail. Illegal trail building and riding jeopardizes legitimate trail access for all of us. The land manager has been very supportive of mountain bikers and new trail ideas (including technical trail features), but all new trails need be approved by the MCPC.

If anyone would like to help design and build new trails at Tourne please reach out to me for volunteer opportunities.
 

notcho

Well-Known Member
Several strava tracks down the trail mentioned above over the past few days. This was from this morning. Stick to the marked trails, we almost lost this place 10 years ago because of riders coming down this way
7194985A-94E9-4830-9F1F-AA73A6293EEE.jpeg
 

extremedave

Well-Known Member
Team MTBNJ Halter's
Several strava tracks down the trail mentioned above over the past few days. This was from this morning. Stick to the marked trails, we almost lost this place 10 years ago because of riders coming down this way View attachment 208991
Anyone we might know? I'm not saying publicly "out" them but maybe an private word to the not-so-wise might help. The bummer is Cam put in some really good stuff over that side and now the entitled few are using it as an excuse to poach the area. Sigh.
 

xrjx

Member
not a knock on the Tourne specifically - but if NJ had more purpose built DH/enduro oriented trails there would be less people creating their own rogue descents. I know this won't be a popular opinion here but I think there's truth to it. If you go into PA or NY there are lots of options for people who are gravity oriented riders. in NJ, there's creek and that's it.
 

Ironjunk

Well-Known Member
not a knock on the Tourne specifically - but if NJ had more purpose built DH/enduro oriented trails there would be less people creating their own rogue descents. I know this won't be a popular opinion here but I think there's truth to it. If you go into PA or NY there are lots of options for people who are gravity oriented riders. in NJ, there's creek and that's it.
I want to say all the NJ idiots would flock to it and get hurt then johnson and johnson jimmys parents would sue but glen park and sprain ridge seems to be doing ok.
 
Last edited:

icebiker

JORBA: Morris Trails
JORBA.ORG
not a knock on the Tourne specifically - but if NJ had more purpose built DH/enduro oriented trails there would be less people creating their own rogue descents. I know this won't be a popular opinion here but I think there's truth to it. If you go into PA or NY there are lots of options for people who are gravity oriented riders. in NJ, there's creek and that's it.
Many years ago Morris County Parks considered something like this at the old Snow Bowl ski area (across from Mahlon Dickerson). Fell off the priority list as trail directors changed, not to mention it’d take a ton of work. But perhaps write to MCPC attention Amy Lutsko and see if it can get back on the radar.
 

xrjx

Member
Many years ago Morris County Parks considered something like this at the old Snow Bowl ski area (across from Mahlon Dickerson). Fell off the priority list as trail directors changed, not to mention it’d take a ton of work. But perhaps write to MCPC attention Amy Lutsko and see if it can get back on the radar.
funny you mention that - I'm local to that area and have always thought that Snow Bowl would be good candidate for this type of a mtb system, but I hadn't heard that this had ever been considered. thanks for the suggestion!
 
FWIW, there are plenty of more DH/enduro oriented trails in NJ that are certainly longer and more challenging than what the Tourne can offer. Wildcat, Wawayanda, Ringwood, Allamuchy, Mahlon Dickerson... all have some variations of this.

I do think this is likely just ignorance. For a lot of reasons, the Tourne attracts people new to the sport. They likely don't realize that they're causing damage to both the environment and the park relationship. I'm sure the trail will be blocked, but a polite explanatory sign to accompany that blockage may help educate why this happened.
 

gmb3

JORBA: Sourlands
JORBA.ORG
Agree, plenty of DH/Enduro terrain in NJ, you just have to work to get there and ride as much up as you do down. People are just lazy and want to ride a road up and then gnarly singletrack down. It's a shame because the new trails put in last year at Tourne are awesome and I'm sure way better than this 2 second fall line.
 

xrjx

Member
FWIW, there are plenty of more DH/enduro oriented trails in NJ that are certainly longer and more challenging than what the Tourne can offer. Wildcat, Wawayanda, Ringwood, Allamuchy, Mahlon Dickerson... all have some variations of this.

I do think this is likely just ignorance. For a lot of reasons, the Tourne attracts people new to the sport. They likely don't realize that they're causing damage to both the environment and the park relationship. I'm sure the trail will be blocked, but a polite explanatory sign to accompany that blockage may help educate why this happened.

Agree, plenty of DH/Enduro terrain in NJ, you just have to work to get there and ride as much up as you do down. People are just lazy and want to ride a road up and then gnarly singletrack down. It's a shame because the new trails put in last year at Tourne are awesome and I'm sure way better than this 2 second fall line.

agreed that there are places in NJ that have fun descents that are long and some challenging. the big difference to me isn't simply that there isn't an easy way up, its more that you have to typically cover significant amount of ground in order to get from one descent to another. so over the course of say a 10-12 mile ride, you get 2 or 3 solid descents. places that are more descent oriented will typically have a number of trails down a single hill from the same or near the same start point allowing you to climb up, descend, and climb back up and pick another option, etc.
 

Cassinonorth

Well-Known Member
People are just lazy and want to ride a road up and then gnarly singletrack down.

Is that really lazy? Compared to an eeb or using a lift to bring your bike up that sounds pretty ambitious. Just because people prefer to use their energy on the descents doesn't make them lazy.

Climbing singletrack isn't everyone's cup of tea.
 

gmb3

JORBA: Sourlands
JORBA.ORG
Is that really lazy? Compared to an eeb or using a lift to bring your bike up that sounds pretty ambitious. Just because people prefer to use their energy on the descents doesn't make them lazy.

Climbing singletrack isn't everyone's cup of tea.
True, not as lazy as Ebiking or riding a lift but if climbing singletrack isn't your cup of tea, then bikeparks are where you belong - free or public. We have 1 of each in NJ, and some of each just outside our borders. "Normal" trail riding in NJ requires climbing singletrack and covering ground. Having trails like this "have a number of trails down a single hill from the same or near the same start point allowing you to climb up, descend, and climb back up and pick another option" typically only happens by new MTB-specific design and build (hard to do legally in NJ) or happy coincidence (and our existing NJ parks are not set up this way).
 

Cassinonorth

Well-Known Member
True, not as lazy as Ebiking or riding a lift but if climbing singletrack isn't your cup of tea, then bikeparks are where you belong - free or public. We have 1 of each in NJ, and some of each just outside our borders. "Normal" trail riding in NJ requires climbing singletrack and covering ground. Having trails like this "have a number of trails down a single hill from the same or near the same start point allowing you to climb up, descend, and climb back up and pick another option" typically only happens by new MTB-specific design and build (hard to do legally in NJ) or happy coincidence (and our existing NJ parks are not set up this way).

Tbh your post comes across as quite gatekeep-y. Bike parks are great, they're not the same as enduro. Dismissing something because it's not your favorite style of riding is not the welcoming way to get people to support JORBA and TM days in NJ.

Enduro style trails work in every other state just fine. I'm shocked that Marty's Trail or High Bridge exists tbh. Something like Berm Park in Canton, NC would be incredible since Creek is closed 6 months of the year to bikes and High Bridge has 2 trails, both 30 seconds long. Not exactly the pinnacle of enduro riding.

And yes, I know we are surrounded by a bunch of enduro style trails (Port Jervis, Glen Park, Trex etc) which is great. Would be even better if we could have one that's in our state. I don't ride a ton of enduro, probably because we don't that style of trail.

also just to be clear; I do not condone building rogue trails in sanctioned areas whatsoever.
 

gmb3

JORBA: Sourlands
JORBA.ORG
I dunno what gatekeep-y means @Cassinonorth but I'm not dismissing anything, just giving the lay of the land in NJ. And I didn't say what my preferred style of riding is - i actually like it all and would love if we have free public bikeparks in NJ like Berm Park. I do mostly trail riding because that's what's in my backyard in NJ and it's free. And as far as amount of legal/sanctioned trails - NJ is pretty awesome in that regard. "Enduro" style riding doesn't really have a clear definition either. To me, all my rides are "Enduro" because i climb slow and push it on descents. Never been to Port Jervis but I would not consider Trexler "Enduro" terrain. To me that's "flow trail". Glen Park is very conducive to Enduro racing now, but it was originally built as illegal shuttle trails and they got lucky by getting them sanctioned after the fact. You are also climbing singletrack there. If your definition of "Enduro" terrain is rocky/technical descents - NJ has that but as previously stated you have to work to get there. If your definition is bermy/jumpy trails, we don't have much. Reasons for that are:
1) rocky terrain to work with in the north, and no elevation to work with in the south
2) lack of enough volunteers/JORBA members
3) hard to get approval for man-made features- even harder if you want machine-built.
4) it's expensive to build with machines
5) lack of wide-open, unused land in a very populated state

I too am surprised High Bridge and Marty's Trail even exist but i know the people involved did a shitton of work to make those things happen. I would also love them to be 5x the size, or have more parks/trails like them - but i know in NJ this is just very hard to do for all the reasons above. My view is to just be grateful for what we have in NJ - because it is pretty great. If anyone has any specific proposals or ideas for "new school" type trails or parks - reach out to JORBA and be part of the solution.
 

roc

Well-Known Member
If this is the section down from the bench and picnic table at the very top, I would say ignorance is definitely a factor. I was hiking there a couple of weeks ago and 2 kids were riding that section and then walking their bikes back up to do it again. I had no idea they weren’t legal trails, they were pretty rode in, and had some gnarly rock sections that I wouldn’t ride anyway. I don’t think the kids were doing anything but being teenagers.

again, thanks to all the people who are making that place awesome. That orange section that goes around the mountain is great! I would say ringwoodish.
 

Ashcor

Active Member
Running on the theory that these are MTB noobs doing this (and it is just a theory) and since we know the entrance point to the rogue descents, would it not be prudent to put a sign there to educate the noobs?

"Riding unmarked, illegally built trails or riding off marked trails is not permitted by MCP. Continued riding of these rogue trails causes erosion and damage to the area and could eventually lead to the banning of all mountain biking in the park by the MCPC. Please do not ride these trial."
 

Trail Conditions

Current Conditions

powered by Trailforks.com
Top Bottom