EBB or slider dropout?

[don]

I don't have any time with EBB so I cannot comment on them.

My Evil Sovereign has sliding dropouts and they work nicely. They have a small bolt on each side to tension the chain.

I've heard good things about Paragon sliders but just don't like the looks of frames with them - it always seem that the axle is so far back from the rear triangle. Under stress and without a proper build this could happen:

http://i327.photobucket.com/albums/k461/Schultz29/Badgrcrack.jpg

The Evil sliders are much nicer looking. I might be getting these if I go w/ a Sinister Ridge this spring:

Lots of weld area for the seat and chainstays. I little beef looking but most likely necessary as it's made out of aluminum.

 

[don]

Had a Zion EBB (26 inch version)... liked the vertical dropouts, but couldn't get the right tension with the EBB without also having to use a half-link.... This really bugged me...

Now have a Surly Karate Monkey with sliding dropouts.... Love em, no half-link required... Removing the tire just requires also loosening the disc brakes (which have slotted mounts) as opposed to having to remove them entirely (which would totally CHEW)...

For me it's a virtual toss-up...

BB

I think EBB's don't have the ability as much range as sliding/horizontal drops. I have to use a half-link on my Rhygin - I agree not too stoked on it as I prefer 3/32" chains to match the chainring and freewheel and there isn't a great half-link to my knowledge.

Are you sure the Karate Monkey has sliding drops or does it have the horizontal dropouts? One way horizontal drops would work with disc brakes is if they were mounted ahead of the axle instead but that brings in clearance issues.

 

[don]

You don't lose the quick release, but you do have to use a chain tensioner, at least on the drive side. I've heard of slippage with braking, but I've never had it with an old skewer and serrated nut on the wheel.
Plus you have to move the brake caliper with the wheel (discs), or pads (rim).

I don't mind having to adjust the brake, but if I were racing a single-speed I'd be using those drops pictured above.

Yeah w/ horizontal/track drops the drive side wants to pull forward and the disc brake side wants to push back. And disc's like to have the hub as straight as possible. It can be a real pain in the ass.

Not to mention, QR w/ chain tensioners tend to start adding up to a lot of pieces and start looking like a lot of stuff (http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2140/2676364230_22c98533c9.jpg?v=0). And more than likely the tensioner will have a 3/8" hole which isn't going to fit great with the small QR size. I always thought it would be cool to have a one piece tensioner/QR nut for this application.

I do like horizontal drops but with a rim brake like I have on my DJ bike. I'm running Knight tensioners which are very compact but made just for 14mm axles.

 

[al415]

The bike being built for me right now is a rim brake specific design with track style drop outs... I like things as simple as possible to match my mind.

 

[Steve Vai]

I vote C!!

There's also this super-trick EBB conversion. Much lighter than a standard EBB. If you decide further down the road you want to go fast and ditch the SS, no problemo

-Jim.

 

[Purple Liquid]

I vote sliding drop out.

The way the rear end is set up on my Specialized is amazing.

 

[don]

I vote sliding drop out.

The way the rear end is set up on my Specialized is amazing.

I have agree - that sliding drop looks really clean.

 

[don]

The bike being built for me right now is a rim brake specific design with track style drop outs... I like things as simple as possible to match my mind.

What hub are you running? I found that with a solid axle or bolt axle like Phil Wood you may not even need tensioners to keep the axle from moving - which will look clean and be simple as pie.

Are you going rim brakes on the front wheel too?

 

[al415]

What hub are you running? I found that with a solid axle or bolt axle like Phil Wood you may not even need tensioners to keep the axle from moving - which will look clean and be simple as pie.

Are you going rim brakes on the front wheel too?

Phil Wood hubs, rim brakes front and rear.

 

[CrossAddict]

EEB All the way!

Simply put if you change gears often as I do to ride different places EBB is the wat to go. "Less is More" <-- Just a single speeder talking

-RoFo

 

[one piece crank]

There is a lot of EBB support around here. Personally I'd never run one, and could never trust it. If you fault the bolts on a sliding dropout, how can you praise the EBB's two tiny set screws (or clamp bolts)?

Without hesitaion I'd go horizontal or sliding drop-out. I'm 220lbs and ride aggressively. I want to know everything is going to stay in its place and not let me down. I even run a 14mm nutted rear axle.

Just the viewpoint from someone who will not tolerate mechanical failure, and never counts ounces (or pounds for that matter!)

Tom P.

 

[BMXxXJ]

i would also never ride a EBB, the thing that bothers me about it moreso than it slipping, it the fact the the bottom bracket position and height changes, affecting the ride of the bike.

 

[bonefishjake]

There is a lot of EBB support around here. Personally I'd never run one, and could never trust it. If you fault the bolts on a sliding dropout, how can you praise the EBB's two tiny set screws (or clamp bolts)?

Without hesitaion I'd go horizontal or sliding drop-out. I'm 220lbs and ride aggressively. I want to know everything is going to stay in its place and not let me down. I even run a 14mm nutted rear axle.

Just the viewpoint from someone who will not tolerate mechanical failure, and never counts ounces (or pounds for that matter!)

Tom P.

to address the weight thing...when i got my mary i was VERY weary about stripping the EBB. at 235 it was a very real concern. everyone told me that i'd smoke it in less than a month. ask anyone here who has riden with me and they'll tell you...i'm a masher (case in point, the cute phrase under my name...).

to cut to it, i never had a single issue with it. no creaking, no slipping, zero. about the only thing i ever do with it is make sure the bolts are tight. it takes approximately 30 seconds if you close your eyes. if you even sort of maintain your bike the EBB is a non-issue.

 

[Fogerson]

Like Jake, I'm not a light weight and have only had a slight creaking problem with the EBB on my SIR9. And once I figured out a little trick using heavy duty ptfe, I haven't had the creaking problem. It has been bullet proof so far.

But, for sh!t and giggles I just picked up one of the newly designed EBB's from Niner. It is sitting here on my desk wondering when it is gonna' find it's way to the SIR9...

And as far as the BB position/height changing, it doesn't change much as the chain stretches. And, I setup the rest of the bike based on the fact it isn't centered (saddle offset, seat height, etc.).

 

[kush]

the argument about changing ride geometry on EBB is not valid, at the very least it is no less egregious as the change from slide on the dropout.

 

[Fogerson]

the argument about changing ride geometry on EBB is not valid, at the very least it is no less egregious as the change from slide on the dropout.

Good point, you're altering the CG and the wheelbase...

 

[bonefishjake]

Good point, you're altering the CG and the wheelbase...

not to mention he used egregious

 

[kush]

not to mention he used egregious

I was going to use an interrobang but had mixed feelings.

 

[Maurice]

the argument about changing ride geometry on EBB is not valid, at the very least it is no less egregious as the change from slide on the dropout.

Just to clarify, changing the BB position will make you have to change seat position/height, and possibly stem length/height. Some gear combo changes will be tricky like that. It does affect geometry but like you say it's on par with moving the rear wheel.

In my case, changes to the BB position are a big deal when I've dialed in my position, but YMMV. It may not matter at all to other people. To each his own.

 

[tommyjay]

So that's what an EBB does! And here I thought it meant a bottom bracket that strolled around town in its pajamas, collected lawn art, and mowed its lawn in the dark.


By the way, let me know how you like the new Niner EBB - I'm getting one on my One9 build and am excited to hear what other people think of it.