Disturbing "no helmet" trend

Tony13

Member
I've noticed that there is a ton of helmetless riders on the trails ever since the pandemic has subsided. Most of them are on box store bikes and are new and very inexperienced riders. I casually mentioned it to a group of ladies who were bouncing their way down the trail this morning.
 
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jackx

Well-Known Member
I've noticed that there is a ton of helmetless riders on the trails ever since the pandemic has subsided. Most of them are on box store bikes and are new and very inexperienced riders. I casually mentioned it to a group of ladies who were bouncing their way down the trail this morning.
I wonder if the heat has something to do with that trend. Probably not.

I wonder how many were wearing sandals.
 

Norm

Mayor McCheese
Team MTBNJ Halter's
Out of every 1 million riders who go without a helmet, how many crash, hurt themselves, sue the park, and get the park closed?

I'm pretty sure that number is like 0. So I wouldn't worry too much about it.
 

Tony13

Member
Out of every 1 million riders who go without a helmet, how many crash, hurt themselves, sue the park, and get the park closed?

I'm pretty sure that number is like 0. So I wouldn't worry too much about it.
I wasn't really worried about lawsuits being brought against the park . It was more a concern for the safety of the uninformed. As well as an observation of the lack of advice or information offered to those who buy bikes at the big box stores.
 

Patrick

Overthinking the draft from the basement already
Staff member
Out of every 1 million riders who go without a helmet, how many crash, hurt themselves, sue the park, and get the park closed?

I'm pretty sure that number is like 0. So I wouldn't worry too much about it.

they won't close the park, just ban mountain bikes.

the bigger problem leading to a ban (imho) is user conflict on multi-use trails.
They aren't going to ban the hikers, so let's be respectful while having fun.
and advocating mtb specific trails.

(i got a ticket for 105 in 55, and didn't really blame the police officers - they wrote it down a bit so it wouldn't be 51+)
 

Norm

Mayor McCheese
Team MTBNJ Halter's
They aren't going to ban the hikers, so let's be respectful while having fun.

Wearing helmets and being disrespectful are not mutually exclusive. There are plenty of people with helmets that are assholes.

Outside magazine just had a good article about some rules of riding. The first & last were: Don't be an asshole. I think that sort of sums up most of the rules really.
 

iLuveketchup

New Member
I wasn't really worried about lawsuits being brought against the park . It was more a concern for the safety of the uninformed. As well as an observation of the lack of advice or information offered to those who buy bikes at the big box stores.
How do you know they were uninformed? If they choose to not wear a helmet and hurt themselves, I say they have the right to. It's like smoking, if they want to kill themselves.. have at it.

Don't get me wrong. I wouldn't get on a bike without a helmet. I'm so clumsy, I should probably should wear one just walking around indoors.
 

Patrick

Overthinking the draft from the basement already
Staff member
How do you know they were uninformed? If they choose to not wear a helmet and hurt themselves, I say they have the right to. It's like smoking, if they want to kill themselves.. have at it.

Don't get me wrong. I wouldn't get on a bike without a helmet. I'm so clumsy, I should probably should wear one just walking around indoors.

Their lawsuit isn't going to say they were uninformed. It is going to say the park was negligent in allowing MTB without proper warning to the dangers involved and how to mitigate them.

This is a very NJ problem.
I'm in your camp on this one - but that is how it will affect the whole group.
Hurt yourself doing something you aren't supposed to do (ie mtb in a no mtb park) and they are more insulated.
(i get the feeling this is the root of the ban in essex county - combined with user conflict - a hiker hurt by a mtb will also sue saying they shouldn't allow the conflict)
 

Tony13

Member
How do you know they were uninformed? If they choose to not wear a helmet and hurt themselves, I say they have the right to. It's like smoking, if they want to kill themselves.. have at it.

Don't get me wrong. I wouldn't get on a bike without a helmet. I'm so clumsy, I should probably should wear one just walking around indoors.
Generally the folks you see on the bikes adorned with reflectors , kickstands and warning labels didn't get that bike from a bike shop. Which in most cases means they were never told about the whole "always wear your helmet " thing. My whole point of this post was a simple observation of all the people who are obviously new to the sport, not taking the precautions that we all know to be important. I had 2 new guys out with me on Sunday, one of them ate it pretty hard, without a helmet it may have been a trip to the hospital. And like a few of the guys pointed out, enough head injuries and the state steps in and saves us from ourselves, which is actually something I wasn't even thinking of.
 

Norm

Mayor McCheese
Team MTBNJ Halter's
How do you know they were uninformed? If they choose to not wear a helmet and hurt themselves, I say they have the right to. It's like smoking, if they want to kill themselves.. have at it.

Don't get me wrong. I wouldn't get on a bike without a helmet. I'm so clumsy, I should probably should wear one just walking around indoors.

Pics of you in helmet at dinner table putting ketchup on something absurd (like cereal) please.
 
Out of every 1 million riders who go without a helmet, how many crash, hurt themselves, sue the park, and get the park closed?

I'm pretty sure that number is like 0. So I wouldn't worry too much about it.

Putting your nose in another person's business is literally a New Jersey pasttime.
 

Norm

Mayor McCheese
Team MTBNJ Halter's
Putting your nose in another person's business is literally a New Jersey pasttime.

Sure. But there is a gray area.

As an example, an absurd one. But it illustrates the point nonetheless.
  • You want to shit wherever you want
  • I don't care, shit in the woods, in the middle of the road, I don't care
  • You decide to shit on my porch
  • I now care
In the above conversation, some people think that not wearing a helmet is shitting on our collective porch. I don't agree, and think it's like them shitting in the woods.

But we do live in a society where people look for others shitting in the woods and look to be upset by it. In a sense, I think a lot of those people thrive in NJ. In another sense, I think the people turned off by that move out of state eventually.
 
Sure. But there is a gray area.

As an example, an absurd one. But it illustrates the point nonetheless.
  • You want to shit wherever you want
  • I don't care, shit in the woods, in the middle of the road, I don't care
  • You decide to shit on my porch
  • I now care
In the above conversation, some people think that not wearing a helmet is shitting on our collective porch. I don't agree, and think it's like them shitting in the woods.

But we do live in a society where people look for others shitting in the woods and look to be upset by it. In a sense, I think a lot of those people thrive in NJ. In another sense, I think the people turned off by that move out of state eventually.
You bet , we have saturated the state with Karens. Yes , they are even in the woods now clutching their pearls and preparing their fainting couches.
 

iLuveketchup

New Member
And like a few of the guys pointed out, enough head injuries and the state steps in and saves us from ourselves, which is actually something I wasn't even thinking of.
I'm sorry what!?! When did you give up your rights to the state? Speaking for myself, I don't need to be saved.
 

Bike N Gear

Shop: Bike N Gear
Shop Keep
I'm sorry what!?! When did you give up your rights to the state? Speaking for myself, I don't need to be saved.
The problem being alluded to above is that if you smash your head into a rock and turn yourself into a vegetable it can affect everyone else. You may be ok with the danger, but your family who now has to care for you for the rest of your life might feel that the Park was unsafe, so they decide to sue. The State gets sued and decides this is is no longer worth the benefit to others. Let's just shut down the mountain biking so we no longer have to deal with these lawsuits.
 

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