Winter Trail Abuse.

jShort

2018 Fantasy Football Toilet Bowl Lead Technician
Team MTBNJ Halter's
Imagine not being able to find away around 2 - 8 foot long fences?

I think you're completely missing the point. It's not meant to be a physical barricade. It's to clearly communicate the trail is closed and should not be ridden. I think it does this much better than a little wooden sign.

If someone is aware that riding muddy trails is not cool, but they just don't care, there's not much you can do about that person.


If you rode cross you'd become proficient at lifting up the tape and riding under without slowing down.
 

Patrick

Overthinking the draft from the basement already
Staff member
People actually take the time to complain to someone about trail conditions? I didn’t even know that option existed, who would someone even complain to, and honestly, why would that person care? In the NJ parks (this is strictly my own observation, I could be 100% wrong) I’ve only seen trail maintenance being done by mountain bike crews. In the Adirondaks, I have seen many hiking trails being maintained by hiking groups, but I’ve never seen that in NJ. You would think that the person who is getting the complaint, would know this. Am I way off the mark?
I’m not saying we should ride in poor conditions, but I would think that whoever you would actually complain to, would have some local knowledge about most of the trail work being done by mountain bikers. Am I nuts?

we have a hiker or two show up at the sourlands when we post up. I think REI also coordinates the hikers there.
 

roc

Well-Known Member
we have a hiker or two show up at the sourlands when we post up. I think REI also coordinates the hikers there.
My guess is those people aren’t the ones complaining, but like I said, it was solely my own personal observation, I knew I could be way off. For me personally I just want to thank all you guys who have been out there, I started riding around summer/fall 2000, mostly ringwood and allamuchy in the first few years. I cannot even believe how many new trails are out there. Ringwood blows my mind.
If I’m riding and I see something that needs attention, I try my best to fix it real quick, new small log over the trail, new widow maker that I can handle, branch at eye height, stuff like that . But the people out there making new trails on their own, on their own time, and making them awesome to boot, all I can say is thanks. Just really don’t understand why some hikers hate bikers, some bikers hate hikers, and so on. Makes no sense to me.
 

stb222

Love Drunk
Jerk Squad
I think you're completely missing the point. It's not meant to be a physical barricade. It's to clearly communicate the trail is closed and should not be ridden. I think it does this much better than a little wooden sign.

If someone is aware that riding muddy trails is not cool, but they just don't care, there's not much you can do about that person.


If you rode cross you'd become proficient at lifting up the tape and riding under without slowing down.
I think it is a perfect example: you bypass that section and enter at the woods (where the trail on that side started years ago). It could be a reasonable assumption that just that trail section was closed. So now it is needed on both sides of that trail and across the woods too, to make it clear. And all of the other access points. 2 min to put up tape just became a bigger effort.
 

rick81721

Lothar
one thing about those signs. they were funded and procured by someone from here. Jdog and I installed them.
it happened with permission of the park. So there is precedent.

Let's face it, those signs do not work. Tape or chain across the trail entrances along with a large TRAIL CLOSED sign is the way to go.
 

Norm

Mayor McCheese
Team MTBNJ Halter's
Let's face it, those signs do not work. Tape or chain across the trail entrances along with a large TRAIL CLOSED sign is the way to go.

Yes, but also posting those signs being up on Facebook/Instagram. I really enjoy riding Nox but as soon as they hang the signs, someone will drop the image on FB/IG, and then many people (including myself) write the park off for a while because I know it's off limits.

Social media can be very useful in this regard.
 

MissJR

not in the mood for your shenanigans
Team MTBNJ Halter's
Yes, but also posting those signs being up on Facebook/Instagram. I really enjoy riding Nox but as soon as they hang the signs, someone will drop the image on FB/IG, and then many people (including myself) write the park off for a while because I know it's off limits.

Social media can be very useful in this regard.
i got a meme for that!

2tljov.jpg
 

rick81721

Lothar
Yes, but also posting those signs being up on Facebook/Instagram. I really enjoy riding Nox but as soon as they hang the signs, someone will drop the image on FB/IG, and then many people (including myself) write the park off for a while because I know it's off limits.

Social media can be very useful in this regard.

Makes sense. I forget about social media because I don't facebook and only use Instagram to post stupid selfies to annoy Kev. The only place I honestly get trail rideability info is here.
 

RobW

Well-Known Member
since our own community is very passionate about this subject, who would volunteer time to spend at the trailhead to educate people on trail abuse? Since this would be a proactive measure, with enough people, this would be funded through JORBA.(first hand response from Tom H)

send me PM to get this going
 

jdog

Shop: Halter's Cycles
Shop Keep
People actually take the time to complain to someone about trail conditions? I didn’t even know that option existed, who would someone even complain to, and honestly, why would that person care? In the NJ parks (this is strictly my own observation, I could be 100% wrong) I’ve only seen trail maintenance being done by mountain bike crews. In the Adirondaks, I have seen many hiking trails being maintained by hiking groups, but I’ve never seen that in NJ. You would think that the person who is getting the complaint, would know this. Am I way off the mark?
I’m not saying we should ride in poor conditions, but I would think that whoever you would actually complain to, would have some local knowledge about most of the trail work being done by mountain bikers. Am I nuts?
Believe me when I tell you that people complain.

I’ve called my contacts at the park and I hope to meet with them this week about possible solutions.

I’m glad that I at least stirred the pot here. It’s 36 degrees out today with an inch of wet snow on top. I’m sure someone is out there now getting muddy.

I’m moderately hopefull about signage solutions, but I do believe in the power of word of mouth.
 

szymon

Active Member
Personally I think you can put up all the signs and tape you want but if the park rangers don't enforce it then the people who are doing the damage will just keep doing it. Riders can put up signs but ultimately the park rangers have the power to close the gate and give tickets. Clayton last week and it was a pretty bad sight to look at when there were guys pulling out with bikes completely covered in mud and the parking lot looked like a big mud puddle. I really think some people honestly don't get a shit, probably the same ones who buzz equestrians. That's another topic but the last couple equestrians I spoke to on the trails were really thankful and happy that I stopped and waited not to scare the horses, from what they said some riders have not been so nice.
 

jShort

2018 Fantasy Football Toilet Bowl Lead Technician
Team MTBNJ Halter's
Personally I think you can put up all the signs and tape you want but if the park rangers don't enforce it then the people who are doing the damage will just keep doing it. Riders can put up signs but ultimately the park rangers have the power to close the gate and give tickets. Clayton last week and it was a pretty bad sight to look at when there were guys pulling out with bikes completely covered in mud and the parking lot looked like a big mud puddle. I really think some people honestly don't get a shit, probably the same ones who buzz equestrians. That's another topic but the last couple equestrians I spoke to on the trails were really thankful and happy that I stopped and waited not to scare the horses, from what they said some riders have not been so nice.


I came across an equestrian on the Columbia Trail not long ago. I saw her coming a mile away so I slowed, got off the bike, and let her by. I said hello and she gave me a look like I shit in her Cheerios.
I told that bitch to get off her high horse.


True story.
 

rick81721

Lothar
I came across an equestrian on the Columbia Trail not long ago. I saw her coming a mile away so I slowed, got off the bike, and let her by. I said hello and she gave me a look like I shit in her Cheerios.
I told that bitch to get off her high horse.


True story.

Haha but that's the exception, isn't it? I've even stopped for equestrians on the road a few times and they have always been grateful.
 

Tim

aka sptimmy43
I stopped and dismounted for an equestrian once where the rider was less than happy that I stopped. He was a novice rider and was having trouble controlling the horse. Needless to say I was a little sketched out when the rider told me to just keep going. The last thing I want is a hoof to the head.
 

Juggernaut

Master of the Metaphor
Equestrians sometimes assume the yield hierarchy applies to them, not their horses. Personally, I really don’t need a half ton animal freaking out and running me (or more importantly, my bike) over.....so stop, calm voice and no sudden moves is what’s called for.
 

RobW

Well-Known Member
Equestrians sometimes assume the yield hierarchy applies to them, not their horses. Personally, I really don’t need a half ton animal freaking out and running me (or more importantly, my bike) over.....so stop, calm voice and no sudden moves is what’s called for.
ive always had great encounters with equestrians. ran into a group of them in Huber, they were not on the trail just yet but were entering. we all stopped and they told us to go which was nice. i guess it depends on the direction you're going.
 

Juggernaut

Master of the Metaphor
ive always had great encounters with equestrians. ran into a group of them in Huber, they were not on the trail just yet but were entering. we all stopped and they told us to go which was nice. i guess it depends on the direction you're going.
At Allaire yes, I totally agree. Sixmile, about 50/50. At Stewart? 100% a holes, 100% of the time. At least that’s my experience.
 

rick81721

Lothar
At Allaire yes, I totally agree. Sixmile, about 50/50. At Stewart? 100% a holes, 100% of the time. At least that’s my experience.

Oddly enough I've never encountered them in 6mr yet. I've seen evidence of recent rideage, and ran into them on the D&R towpath coming or going there, but not on the trails.
 

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