Transgender cyclist wins women’s championship

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rlb

Well-Known Member
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wonderturtle

Well-Known Member
I'm going to say two things:

1- If people want to discuss this topic, BE RESPECTFUL!

I agree. So here goes:

I respect that she identifies as a female and desires to be identified as such in society. But when it comes to sports it’s simply an unfair advantage. IMHO

I am not sure how to draw such lines.

But there are rules against performance enhancing drugs, blood dopping, etc for a reason - to even the playing field. A person having the physical advantage - testosterone, muscle density, etc of being being biologically or physically (whatever is the respectful way to say it) male - is simply an unfair advantage in sports against women.
 
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seanrunnette

Brain Damaged Ray Romano
Team MTBNJ Halter's
But there are rules...
...and the rules were adhered to. USAC and the UCI have no problem with her racing. And if she qualifies for the Olympics, the IOC says she'll be able to compete there as well.
"A transgender woman must be able to demonstrate a continued level of endogenous testosterone below a certain level for one year, that level is 10 nanomoles per liter. Because I race in the UCI I absolutely have to meet that policy, and I have provided medical evidence to USAC that I more than meet that policy."
She met their requirements, as she has throughout her racing career, and won. Period. Chapeau McKinnon!
 

MissJR

not in the mood for your shenanigans
Team MTBNJ Halter's
I'm just curious: Does anyone take issue with female to male athletes or intersex athletes? Or is it just that you guys feel us fragile women need to be protected?

As a woman racer, I have no issue with this at all.
 

RobW

Well-Known Member
...and the rules were adhered to. USAC and the UCI have no problem with her racing. And if she qualifies for the Olympics, the IOC says she'll be able to compete there as well.
"A transgender woman must be able to demonstrate a continued level of endogenous testosterone below a certain level for one year, that level is 10 nanomoles per liter. Because I race in the UCI I absolutely have to meet that policy, and I have provided medical evidence to USAC that I more than meet that policy."
She met their requirements, as she has throughout her racing career, and won. Period. Chapeau McKinnon!
so basically any "person" that has Low T levels which passes the tests can compete as a woman?- basically what she is saying
 

wonderturtle

Well-Known Member
Or is it just that you guys feel us fragile women need to be protected?

I think the person having developed as a male, going through puberty as male, resulting in a male body gives this person an unfair advantage (in physical competition) over women who dont have a male body. Just like drugs and blood doping create an unfair advantage.

To me this issue is about trying to keep an even playing field

I think this is a respectful and reasonable opinion. So I similarly request respectful responses to my opinion
 

choop

Well-Known Member
I haven't read up on the science on transgender physiology, but I would think that the fitness, muscular, and physiological gains while a male would still transfer to the athlete as a woman. Similar to the principle that you can dope, stop doping, and still reap the rewards of the doping years after stopping. Under that premise, I do question the fairness, but know that there could be studies that have proven it wrong. I haven't taken the time to do any research.

That being said, she is following all the rules that are in place, so congrats to her.
 

Tim

aka sptimmy43
I'm just curious: Does anyone take issue with female to male athletes or intersex athletes? Or is it just that you guys feel us fragile women need to be protected?

As a woman racer, I have no issue with this at all.

I personally don't feel anyone needs to be "protected." Male and female biology is different. One is not better than the other but in their respective differences they have advantages in certain situations.

I think that if transgender competition gets to a point where it really isn't competitive then the rules will be changed. For now congrats to Rachel.
 

rick81721

Lothar
so basically any "person" that has Low T levels which passes the tests can compete as a woman?- basically what she is saying

That is one point I find interesting: McKinnon argues that even testosterone testing violates her rights. She believes there is no hard evidence that testosterone levels enhance performance, and as such ideally that shouldn't be a requirement either. Again, she does adhere to current legal requirements, but she basically believes that anyone who thinks they are female should be able to compete as a female. And I would assume, vice versa.
 

seanrunnette

Brain Damaged Ray Romano
Team MTBNJ Halter's
so basically any "person" that has Low T levels which passes the tests can compete as a woman?- basically what she is saying
Not sure what the quotes around person mean, but yes, what the USAC, WADA, the IOC and the UCI are saying is that anyone who identifies as a woman and has a qualifying testosterone level for one year prior to competition can compete as a woman. Rachel McKinnon met that requirement.
 

Norm

Mayor McCheese
Team MTBNJ Halter's
It just seems to me that men bring this topic up more than women. And it's always the male to female transgender and intersex athletes that are put up for discussion.

Why do you keep derailing the discussion towards an attack on men? You’re violating your own initial post.
 

rick81721

Lothar
I think fairness of competition vs basic human rights gets muddled up here unfortunately.

Agree. And to the point of WTM transgenders, the reality is there are very few olympic sports where being genetically female is an advantage. There are a few - archery, equestrian. In those sports, the same rules of fairness should apply.
 

Patrick

Overthinking the draft from the basement already
Staff member
so basically any "person" that has Low T levels which passes the tests can compete as a woman?- basically what she is saying

The opposite is also interesting, in the fact that using T is considered doping, and that all women must adhere some guidelines, even if they are high-T naturally.
There is a push to document in early life.

https://www.bmj.com/company/newsroo...female-athletes-significant-competitive-edge/
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This topic isn't new - Dr R. Richards - 1975.
Yes, I'm old enough to remember this.
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As a high school track and XC official, this is on the radar. It is more for identified, than reassigned sexuality (not sure if that is the correct term)
an athlete can claim their gender, and the officials accept that claim. Coaches can discuss, and appeal, but not to the officials on-site.
I'd only see the coaches having an issue if the gender claim switched mid-season.
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My personal opinion ? I have to trust in the ruling bodies (interesting term in context?) to do their research, and establish the correct guidelines.
If the pool of athletes becomes large enough, should their be another category of gender? maybe.
Or as the lines get blurred, should gender categories disappear? at the amateur level and/or elite level?
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And yes - there are f2m elite athletes.

C. Mosier
I looked this up, and then recalled hearing about it.
 
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