RaceClean?

Delish

Well-Known Member
Team MTBNJ Halter's
Under the new leadership of Bouchard-Hall, USACycling has implemented some changes to rider licensing in 2016. Among these changes is a RaceClean surcharge of $5, $25 of $50 (depending on your category and type of license) to "dramatically increase anti-doping tests in 2016," particularly at the amateur level.

USAC will lose $1M this year and clearly USAC has is detractors--people love to trash USAC, including me. But, I am cautiously optimisting that Bouchard-Hall "gets it" and will do what he can to change the culture.

Here's my take on RaceClean:
Many pro-level racers have complained that they should not have to pay more to enforce drug testing for amateurs. The argument is essentially "why punish me for the actions of a few assclown amateur masters doping dicks." To that, I would ask why should pros be the only ones who get a chance at a fair, clean racing? Yes it's a depressing sign of things when masters/amateurs feel the need to take PEDs but if you don't think it's a real issue, lets take a look at the data. Scanning through the list of USADA sacntions for the past couple years, a large percentage of them are for amateurs and here's a quick sampling:
Oscar Tovar, 31, testosterone (busted at a Grand-friggin-Fondo of all things)
Todd Robertson, 51 Modafinil (2nd strike)
Daniel Baker, 37 (Cat 3 CX racer LOL) synthetic testosterone
David LeDuc, 63, EPO, exogenous steroids and amphetamines
David Anthony, 45, synthetic erythropoietin (EPO), also busted at a Grand Fondo.

Personally, I will gladly pay a little extra to know that when I get beaten, it's because the other guy trained harder, dug deeper, or just generally sucks less than I do.

What say you? Is this the beginning of the end of USAC in amateur bike racing, especially mountain bike racing? Or does this signify the start of a change within USAC that will keep it relevant? Will RaceClean work as an effective deterrent? Will you be renewing your USAC license next year?
 

1speed

Incredibly profound yet fantastically flawed
I have no dog in this fight because I've never been nor ever will be a USAC license holder (I just don't GAF about being "legitimized" by some org for something I do as recreation, I have no desire or need to ever be recognized as a pro, and I can fill my race season every year just fine without needing any USAC races.) That said, I've seen this issue blow up on social media the last few days, with 100% of the reactions being strongly negative. My thought based on that fact alone is that this may be the death knell for USAC in amateur racing.
 

gtluke

The Moped
How much of this is a battle of information and "better doping" and can it be stopped? I'm sure we all agree that the top level guys are still doping, and not getting caught (at the time). How much of that information will come out to the mortals so they can do it too? There's no excuse for getting busted with synthetic testosterone. There are better ways. If I recall correctly the only way to combat testosterone doping is to have a good history of the T levels of the athlete and set a limit for the T-levels across the board. They will just supplement testosterone until they hit that level.
Neat that they can figure out if you have used an IV bag recently because of plastic particles in your blood. You better have a damn good excuse for having used one. Or get yourself a setup that just uses glass.
 
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stb222

Love Drunk
Jerk Squad
Personally, I will gladly pay a little extra to know that when I get beaten, it's because the other guy trained harder, dug deeper, or just generally sucks less than I do.

More testing, great, but I think we all know it won't solve the doping issue. Plenty of the pros have beaten the system and they are the most tested ones.
 

Norm

Mayor McCheese
Team MTBNJ Halter's
While I don't think this bodes well for USAC I don't see the org going anywhere. It will lose it's hold in mountain biking in this area in ~2 years I think. As it is that hold is tenuous. Of the 20 MTB events inside of a 2 hour radius of central jersey, I would guess that 7 of them are USAC sanctioned at most. Maybe only 5. I think this will just push USAC off that radar before too long.

If anything this will solidify it as a road organization. The real question I ask is this. Where does cross go? I would not be surprised if 25% of the masters are doping. I would be more than happy to see more testing in the cross races. I'll piss in whatever cup you give me any day of the week but I think we can all agree that my results don't exactly suggest I get help in any respect, aside from maybe directions to the dessert bar.
 

stb222

Love Drunk
Jerk Squad
How much of this is a battle of information and "better doping" and can it be stopped? I'm sure we all agree that the top level guys are still doping, and not getting caught (at the time). How much of that information will come out to the mortals so they can do it too? There's no excuse for getting busted with synthetic testosterone. There are better ways. If I recall correctly the only way to combat testosterone doping is to have a good history of the T levels of the athlete and set a limit for the T-levels across the board. They will just supplement testosterone until they hit that level.
Neat that they can figure out if you have used an IV bag recently because of plastic particles in your blood. You better have a damn good excuse for having used one. Or get yourself a setup that just uses glass.
Vitamins via blood bags or a saline drip after a hard race/stage is apparently the work around there. That is why this younger generation has a "no needle" policy as it was a normal thing to take vitamins via a needle. The biological passport was supposed to fix the issue of levels over time, but it doesn't seem to have been implemented properly.
 

Delish

Well-Known Member
Team MTBNJ Halter's
How much of this is a battle of information and "better doping" and can it be stopped? I'm sure we all agree that the top level guys are still doping, and not getting caught (at the time). How much of that information will come out to the mortals so they can do it too? There's no excuse for getting busted with synthetic testosterone. There are better ways. If I recall correctly the only way to combat testosterone doping is to have a good history of the T levels of the athlete and set a limit for the T-levels across the board. They will just supplement testosterone until they hit that level.
Neat that they can figure out if you have used an IV bag recently because of plastic particles in your blood. You better have a damn good excuse for having used one. Or get yourself a setup that just uses glass.

I don't really see this as having to do with the doping arms race. Where there is a will (i.e. financial incentive) there will be those who innovate to beat the testing, but were' talking about the top 0.01% of the sport. I think most of the doping taking place by amateurs and up-comers is straight up meat and potatoes, easy to test for stuff.
 

gtluke

The Moped
I don't really see this as having to do with the doping arms race. Where there is a will (i.e. financial incentive) there will be those who innovate to beat the testing, but were' talking about the top 0.01% of the sport. I think most of the doping taking place by amateurs and up-comers is straight up meat and potatoes, easy to test for stuff.
yeah I guess that's what I was getting at. Does it just eliminate the easy ways and leave only the hard ways, and do the hard ways become easier and more widespread? It seems dumb to NOT test, so finding that level of testing is the point of discussion. IIRC those high end WADA tests cost $45,000, clearly that's not going to happen in US cycling. But then all you need to know is what are they leaving out of the $1,000 testing setup?
 

Delish

Well-Known Member
Team MTBNJ Halter's
If anything this will solidify it as a road organization. The real question I ask is this. Where does cross go? I would not be surprised if 25% of the masters are doping. I would be more than happy to see more testing in the cross races. I'll piss in whatever cup you give me any day of the week but I think we can all agree that my results don't exactly suggest I get help in any respect, aside from maybe directions to the dessert bar.

I agree on the road front. Yes, the big Q is here does cross go from here? But paint me a plausible scenario in which USAC lets cross slip out of it's greedy prying hands? Cross is the growth engine for the sport and there's big $ in it now. I have a hard time seeing how USAC can hang on to MTB at this point.
 

The Heckler

You bring new meaning to the term SUCK
63.

I can't really say I'm at a level where I'm concerned if someone ahead of me is doping. Though I say that assuming if I am racing dopers there are not many.

My take is it's waste of money testing anyone in the 3/4/5 open age cats. Enforcing the upgrades should be of more concern. If you're doping those classes and winning you would be forced up to the Elites/Elite Masters race where doping should be enforced.

Though if I'm paying an extra $50 I'm not going to be a happy camper. In fact, if I pay $50 and don't get piss tested I will be DOUBLE unhappy.

~Yes, I realize I took an extra season on my CX 3->2 but I do wish someone said "congrats you're a 2 now."~
 

1speed

Incredibly profound yet fantastically flawed
Not to jack the thread on the original question, but the thing I don't get in all of this is who these amateur dopers appear to be - just look at the ages above: no one there is under 30. What is the endgame there? I mean, none of those people can seriously think they have a legitimate shot at a pro career at their ages, can they? And if not, then that leaves - what? An ego thing? Again, considering their ages, shouldn't they be old enough (and rational enough) to know that this is a past-time - a distraction from the reality of bills, mortgages, family issues, etc.? What do they gain by doping? If you are cyclist in these age ranges, chances are you are doing it because it's a fitness thing, it's a social thing, or it's a competitive thing. Loosely, I think that covers the possible reasons why most of us ride into adulthood. So if it's a fitness thing, doping makes zero sense because you can't personally know if you are achieving what you set out to achieve health-wise. If it's a social thing, then there really is no rationale for doping at all. And if it's a competitive thing, shouldn't the recognition that your achievements aren't your own ruin the idea of doping? As amateurs, they are competing with themselves first and foremost, so wouldn't doping get in the way? Like if I beat someone I've never beaten before only after I took EPO or testosterone or whatever, wouldn't it feel pretty hollow? I actually get why pros do it - it's their livelihood on the line. It's not right, but it is understandable in the sense that they are fighting for income. I even get it if a few younger guys are doping to break into the ranks of pros -- they are auditioning for a job and finding a shortcut to stand above their competition in a limited marketplace. But for amateurs in their 30's and beyond? Why? I know that the problem is going to grow as these "low T" drugs become more commonplace for people trying to hang on to their youth, but I think those folks will eventually have to reconcile with the fact that their choices make them ineligible for certain activities. But these guys are being caughtwith real PEDs -- EPO and the like. That's not trying to hang on to overall health -- that's looking for a competitive advantage only. And I just don't get that thought process in otherwise seemingly rational adults with nothing to gain but a trophy, a small financial purse, or first pick at a prize table.
 

Norm

Mayor McCheese
Team MTBNJ Halter's
I would assume they do it for the simple reason that it feels good. Sort of like when you drink a beer, you get that layer of relaxation & comfort between you and the world. Imagine that you could take a pill (or I guess jam a needle in your ass, but the story is less enticing with an ass-needle) and your recovery time went from 2 days to a day. I mean, I think it's like that. You know I turned 44 this year and shit hurts more than it used to. We get older and make all these goofy shakes and soups and salads to make us heal up faster. I imagine these guys just take that pill and put it next to their shake and salad. It's just a thing that makes them feel better and be able to go out and ride hard again the next day.

I mean I would have to think that's a huge first part of it - it just makes everything feel better.
 

Patrick

Overthinking the draft from the basement already
Staff member
they probably cheat at other things in life, or can't stand coming in behind someone else cause they were always the best at what they did....

i know both types.....
 

Juggernaut

Master of the Metaphor
I'll try to keep this rant "civil".

Yes, I do hold a USAC license. You can stop laughing now...

I despise the "UCI" with a passion as they are about as disgusting and corrupt as they come.

Pror to the regime change at "USAC", you could probably say the same thing about them. Now, I just don't know.

"USAC" has been on a power grab for a couple of years now and it's "strong arm bullying tactics" show they have no issue getting further into bed with their masters at the "UCI".
( And you can quote me on that)

Worming their way into the "Fondo" scene. Strong arming small event promoters. Threatening it's pros not to do races "USAC" wasn't getting a cut of. Stepping in and just inserting a "Fatbike World Championship" with out qualifying races and completely ignoring the grass roots already established fatbike championship to name just a few examples of bad behavior.

I do not trust any of them to do anything other than money grab; and until "WADA", and by extension "USADA", demonstrate that they are anything but "No Show" employee organizations, I say NO!

2c

Dan
 
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Blair

Well-Known Member
There's just a lot of stupid people and this costs society more to keep those people from being a danger to themselves and others.
 

xc62701

Well-Known Member
I don't even think this is about doping as it is about getting USAC more funds. It has been said that they are in a decline and I think this is a way to get out of that and "try" to make it logical to the body of racers it supports. It's greedy BS if you ask me. Testing is a good idea and I would feel better if it cleans up the sport but not at a forced increase to all the members.

I am hoping that promoters get away from the stronghold that USAC has and it's road tactics for the MTB world. Just remember how last year and the previous years they were going to impose a fine if USAC pro racers competed in non-USAC events - REALLY? At least they went in the right direction and dropped that nonsense.

I am seriously on the fence for getting a license again. At the very least I will downgrade to not give these jerks the money($200 for my license? WTF??? maybe if I actually made some money with this damn thing...) and the only thing I would like to keep my license for is cross but I'd be just as happy with other non-USAC mtb events in place of the cross races. I'm sad it has to come to this but I'm fed up.
 

jnos

Well-Known Member
Not to jack the thread on the original question, but the thing I don't get in all of this is who these amateur dopers appear to be - just look at the ages above: no one there is under 30. What is the endgame there?

I don't understand the rationale if you are not a pro (Masters racers win some cash, but not nearly enough to cover the cost of equipment let alone turn a profit). That said, racing is a frustrating thing. Winning the B race or a Masters race in CX is tough. It requires lots of hard work and sacrifice (I assume...I'm never near the front of race). Waking up early before work to ride, skipping weekend events so you can be well rested to race, driving 1-5 hours every weekend and paying for a hotel to be at the race, etc. All of that sounds like crazy dedication when you are definitely not going to turn pro. Adding PEDs to your routine just doesn't seem like a huge jump from here.
 

ryderX

Well-Known Member
Not to jack the thread on the original question, but the thing I don't get in all of this is who these amateur dopers appear to be - just look at the ages above: no one there is under 30. What is the endgame there? I mean, none of those people can seriously think they have a legitimate shot at a pro career at their ages, can they? And if not, then that leaves - what? An ego thing? Again, considering their ages, shouldn't they be old enough (and rational enough) to know that this is a past-time - a distraction from the reality of bills, mortgages, family issues, etc.? What do they gain by doping? If you are cyclist in these age ranges, chances are you are doing it because it's a fitness thing, it's a social thing, or it's a competitive thing. Loosely, I think that covers the possible reasons why most of us ride into adulthood. So if it's a fitness thing, doping makes zero sense because you can't personally know if you are achieving what you set out to achieve health-wise. If it's a social thing, then there really is no rationale for doping at all. And if it's a competitive thing, shouldn't the recognition that your achievements aren't your own ruin the idea of doping? As amateurs, they are competing with themselves first and foremost, so wouldn't doping get in the way? Like if I beat someone I've never beaten before only after I took EPO or testosterone or whatever, wouldn't it feel pretty hollow? I actually get why pros do it - it's their livelihood on the line. It's not right, but it is understandable in the sense that they are fighting for income. I even get it if a few younger guys are doping to break into the ranks of pros -- they are auditioning for a job and finding a shortcut to stand above their competition in a limited marketplace. But for amateurs in their 30's and beyond? Why? I know that the problem is going to grow as these "low T" drugs become more commonplace for people trying to hang on to their youth, but I think those folks will eventually have to reconcile with the fact that their choices make them ineligible for certain activities. But these guys are being caughtwith real PEDs -- EPO and the like. That's not trying to hang on to overall health -- that's looking for a competitive advantage only. And I just don't get that thought process in otherwise seemingly rational adults with nothing to gain but a trophy, a small financial purse, or first pick at a prize table.
And that's why you're not a doper.
 

soundz

The Hat
Team MTBNJ Halter's
USAC races should be boycotted until it is found to be (relatively) clean. Individuals will self-clean when they see 2 people in their field who are also doping. Either that or or it will go out of business and something else will eventually take its place, hopefully with less people doping.
 

Joe J

Well-Known Member
USAC races should be boycotted until it is found to be (relatively) clean. Individuals will self-clean when they see 2 people in their field who are also doping. Either that or or it will go out of business and something else will eventually take its place, hopefully with less people doping.


What would make you think dopers are only doing USAC events now?



I don’t think/hope doping is as wide spread as some think but if it is this will hopefully help.



It may be cost prohibitive but if they really want to end doping just test everyone. If you hold a license you would get an email sometime during the year and have a limited amount of time to get to a local lab. If you fail or don’t go you’re suspended.



The one issue I see with more testing is it will take away the excuse some use for getting beat to save there ego. I can’t count the number of time I’ve heard – So & So only beat me because he/she is a doper or So & So must be doping because I’m X-Min. faster than them in MTB but they beat me in CX.



One last thought. Racers better become very aware of the band substance list. There are a lot of things that are marketed as supplements and sold over the counter that will test positive even though they are snake oil. Even if you have a prescription from a doctor for certain medications you are prohibited from competing.
 
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