getting back on the road, what to consider

qclabrat

qclabrat

Well-Known Member
After drinking the koolaid that a CX/gravel bike can double as a road bike (they really don't), I'm ready to get on to my next build. I spoke with @echappy a few months ago and he mentioned time trialing, which I thought was only for staged races, but it perked my interest to look at road bikes again. Seems like the hot road segment nowadays is the endurance category like the Giant Defy that Jim has been riding all over the east coast. But I want something flat out fast for 2 hour rides. Let's talk frames first then parts. I'll initially be using some Force bits from the parts bin but would like to eventually go eTap or EPS. Do frames come ready for both mechanical and electronic? The new Venge and Propel are nice, but out of the price range, need to keep under 5k for the final build and fast wheels are going to be a good portion of the budget. So that will likely leave me under 2k for a frame. Besides price what are the biggest differences between a high grade carbon (e.g., Hi-mod, Advanced-SL) vs standard monocoque? I'm going to start looking in the secondary market in addition to new. So which ones should I consider and why?
 
hey @qclabrat, good to have you back Stateside and riding

as for ITT, there are a lot of events here in NJ (a series of 10-14, i think), and all of them have a separate Merckx division. So that's probably what you'd be looking at, if you want to try out time trialing.

As for bikes, you should probably answer the question whether you want it to be rim or disc brake. Your best bet is to buy a new bike on sale, as opposed to building it up frame up. Many of the $5k-6k bikes (upper range of which should become 5k when on sale) should come with more than decent wheels, and wheels really don't do that much all things considered. They are one of the least effective ways of reducing aero drag. The frame is also one of the least effective ways.

Canyon is probably a good place to start. Their Aeroad bikes are respectable, but apparently not the fastest out there. But they are less than $5k and comes with Di2. Trek will probably have a sale on their Madones soon. One thing you want to keep in mind is that adjustment and cable/housing replacement on these aero road bikes are a royal pain; alas, Di2/Etap/EPS should get preference over mechanical shifting.

In terms of what (other than watts) makes one fast on a road bike:
-Position (the old saddle-to-bar drop is a decent indicator); can be achieved with stretching.
-Clothing: no/few wrinkles; cover up skin; no gloves when racing
-Things that hit air first: helmets, aero road handlebars; handlebar width also affects things
-Cleanliness of the front end
-Also, tubeless set up with a fast tire. This also gets overlooked
 
Van Dessel Motivus Maximus as about as future proof as any bike I've seen. Caliper or disc compatible. T/A or QR. Aero. Light. Takes big tires. Mechanical or Electronic shifting compatible. Order it any way you like and pick up from your local VD dealer. Plus, Edwin and the parent company do a lot of great things for the sport both locallay and beyond.
MOTIVUS-MAXIMUS-Van-Dessel-Silver.jpg
 
echappy said:
hey @qclabrat, good to have you back Stateside and riding

as for ITT, there are a lot of events here in NJ (a series of 10-14, i think), and all of them have a separate Merckx division. So that's probably what you'd be looking at, if you want to try out time trialing.

As for bikes, you should probably answer the question whether you want it to be rim or disc brake. Your best bet is to buy a new bike on sale, as opposed to building it up frame up. Many of the $5k-6k bikes (upper range of which should become 5k when on sale) should come with more than decent wheels, and wheels really don't do that much all things considered. They are one of the least effective ways of reducing aero drag. The frame is also one of the least effective ways.

Canyon is probably a good place to start. Their Aeroad bikes are respectable, but apparently not the fastest out there. But they are less than $5k and comes with Di2. Trek will probably have a sale on their Madones soon. One thing you want to keep in mind is that adjustment and cable/housing replacement on these aero road bikes are a royal pain; alas, Di2/Etap/EPS should get preference over mechanical shifting.

In terms of what (other than watts) makes one fast on a road bike:
-Position (the old saddle-to-bar drop is a decent indicator); can be achieved with stretching.
-Clothing: no/few wrinkles; cover up skin; no gloves when racing
-Things that hit air first: helmets, aero road handlebars; handlebar width also affects things
-Cleanliness of the front end
-Also, tubeless set up with a fast tire. This also gets overlooked
Click to expand...
haha, your talk about TT perked interested to get a faster bike, but not necessarily TT racing specifically, though I would consider trying one next year
I'm not at all looking to be like this, I've got too many back ailments to allow for it. I see what you mean by no gloves.
1534517175348.png
 
Sounds like any Bicycling Magazine recommendation would be for you.

If you believe the hype, aero road bikes are all the rage but for use mortals, it likely doesn’t make much of a difference unless you pulling above 25 all the time. The downside is the frames are hurtful to the eyes.

At this point I would go for disc brakes, I haven’t made the switch but buying new, seems like the way to go.

Canyon Is hot right now.
 
qclabrat said:
After drinking the koolaid that a CX/gravel bike can double as a road bike (they really don't), I'm ready to get on to my next build. I spoke with @echappy a few months ago and he mentioned time trialing, which I thought was only for staged races, but it perked my interest to look at road bikes again. Seems like the hot road segment nowadays is the endurance category like the Giant Defy that Jim has been riding all over the east coast. But I want something flat out fast for 2 hour rides. Let's talk frames first then parts. I'll initially be using some Force bits from the parts bin but would like to eventually go eTap or EPS. Do frames come ready for both mechanical and electronic? The new Venge and Propel are nice, but out of the price range, need to keep under 5k for the final build and fast wheels are going to be a good portion of the budget. So that will likely leave me under 2k for a frame. Besides price what are the biggest differences between a high grade carbon (e.g., Hi-mod, Advanced-SL) vs standard monocoque? I'm going to start looking in the secondary market in addition to new. So which ones should I consider and why?
Click to expand...

Fast wheels for climbing or flat ground? I went to 45mm carbon wheels this year and although they're noticeably quicker in the flats, as soon as you hit the hills you can tell the difference from a lightweight option. If I lived up north...like Sparta-ish...where there's lots of rolling hills, I'd personally stick to a very lightweight wheel option vs deep/aero.
 
stb222 said:
Sounds like any Bicycling Magazine recommendation would be for you.

If you believe the hype, aero road bikes are all the rage but for use mortals, it likely doesn’t make much of a difference unless you pulling above 25 all the time. The downside is the frames are hurtful to the eyes.

At this point I would go for disc brakes, I haven’t made the switch but buying new, seems like the way to go.

Canyon Is hot right now.
Click to expand...
Are you still on a Hi-mod frame? Is weight the only consideration for the better carbon?
Seems like anyone moving up to the good stuff won't go back.
 
qclabrat said:
Are you still on a Hi-mod frame? Is weight the only consideration for the better carbon?
Seems like anyone moving up to the good stuff won't go back.
Click to expand...
Yes, I had two cannondale road frames and both were hi-mod, it is more for ride quality.

The good stuff has a tipping point. I have good stuff on bike but still can’t swallon the price of full carbon wheels.
 
Spending money on road bikes when you're not really into road biking is a waste.

-Disk Brakes, preferably hydraulic.
-105 or Apex (Seriously, Tiagra is probably fine)
-25mm or larger tires.

If you find a bike with the above it'll meet your needs just as well as a $4-$5k bike.

Let's be serious, an $800 10 year old road bike fits your needs just as well.

If you REALLY get into it, fine, buy the really expensive road bike. But for now you seem to be buying what type of riding you think you'll be doing, not the riding you're actually doing.
 
qclabrat said:
haha, your talk about TT perked interested to get a faster bike, but not necessarily TT racing specifically, though I would consider trying one next year
I'm not at all looking to be like this, I've got too many back ailments to allow for it. I see what you mean by no gloves.
View attachment 75325
Click to expand...
So this is what you want to ride for your "2hr long fast" rides?
 
Didn't you swear off road riding last year or so? Or was it because of injury at the time?
 
my first road bike back in 2012 was a trek 1.2 with 9 speed sora groupset, i still ride it.

I just bought a new(to me, used from my bike shop) trek ion with 10 speed ultegra and a set of bontrager aura wheels (this was an impulse buy since i was offered such a good price on it). It shifts and rides so much nicer, but i can definitely feel a difference in how it responds (yes its technically a CX bike) but overall speeds are the same (negligible differences anyway).

I guess my point is that the above is the best advice i have seen, buy an affordable road bike that fits well and ride it. Road riding is not my thing, i borderline hate it, but its a great way to train and stay in shape, but dont sink a ton of money into it if your not in love with it and planning to race.
 
C8N said:
Didn't you swear off road riding last year or so? Or was it because of injury at the time?
Click to expand...
last year I was riding a gravel bike on the road, which was never particularly fun. It's great on trails but twitchy downhill and turns. This year I rode a touring bike on the road and though it served it's purpose, the bike is over 30 pounds and short daily rides were far from fast, but that's not what it does. I've sold all my other road bikes in the past few years so looking for a sub 20 pound road bike which would get me to enjoy short rides again. I agree that I could spend less, and I likely will, but interested in knowing what 5k brings nowadays. Tossed out 5k as a starting point, as I don't know what has changed in 7-8 years since I bought a road bike (carbon Fuji). I'd like to get a carbon frame is 2k a reasonable budget for a used complete bike?
 
qclabrat said:
last year I was riding a gravel bike on the road, which was never particularly fun. It's great on trails but twitchy downhill and turns. This year I rode a touring bike on the road and though it served it's purpose, the bike is over 30 pounds and short daily rides were far from fast, but that's not what it does. I've sold all my other road bikes in the past few years so looking for a sub 20 pound road bike which would get me to enjoy short rides again. I agree that I could spend less, and I likely will, but interested in knowing what 5k brings nowadays. Tossed out 5k as a starting point, as I don't know what has changed in 7-8 years since I bought a road bike (carbon Fuji). I'd like to get a carbon frame is 2k a reasonable budget for a used complete bike?
Click to expand...

I've been happy with Cannondale - first one was a supersix, now evo hi-mod. I might have a slightly burned frame for you after tomorrow...
 
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