Fixing pianos, bikes, and myself **New, now with accordions and concertinas!**

Karate Monkey

Well-Known Member
Hi, my name is [redacted]. I work on pianos, play the piano (and the organ too!), sing, work on bikes, and ride bikes...until I got hit by a car. I started riding about 8 years ago, in college, when I was an unhappy 225 pounds, and at high risk for diabetes (Grandma, mom and both her siblings, as well as my brother, all have it)...today, I'm a [relatively] svelte 170 pounds, with some work left to do. Until I'm actually able to ride again, and in an effort to not pic dump the DIY thread to death, I figured it was about time to start my own thread here.

Thanks to @fidodie , who is an enabler, I now have a second player piano (third in the house!), and less crap in the garage. Replacing 600-or-so pounds of weights is a Cable player piano from sometime between 1925-1930. Here are a couple of shots of the finish, before cleaning:

WrWlwG4lZQMChd4-7MpiJL0cOcF9KulLAvBMW9R_UgzBZ-SFU0NW-1-lXc0_E94nJ6biqk4Onxgp_9u1lwas2lVbBe3CwwIeY5_-dTvxkuAw66E3o4qyFgIEGrfdFcp-8-acxRcJIdJAhPRdiFTedaQ_R8j1Nv3opizBcEHcjRMjslWlNvDLOSseEF7ykoQW5O7cT1SKUzfIDIAvTIWZVAQQrcojuTvNvDFk14noKkWk8VfXZ81pJ6nSxb2C0jMPt9EP1INtO8GXq5NP_s8X43GH2QyznseD9A7c0PkaahiXrN1ZITYGqbW6ZPDYQEVjdHHExjzHFae1V92m1hfA3Q9zj3XBjmmRadfGFivP6PrnIsqeV-N4uUev1uGkOZtUxFT2xfCw9zvmntJjZXQkrBusbi3cQRNGaqj96mEsb75K3ijPVYHwOICBbizNFN-gV6keXiArPVc5M6bsvjbfbOFcgofVsWs0W-LCCi8A4iYc7LATxexbvZwlyPkBN4I5kjGbwbb1Y1iU8197LIMbGVoB7V2lk4-zSrqQ4aKPHGbIseBpw5yQzLJ45RXMRL0c9oHA5yv3RYh9acrK5ED-OUr19CP7qh1sm1KXpHYrWRsJCYLmWZre9jbT48XDag_helJMhA6Ig3SPqqzFnISyEx00uTz52EFvyVHOqlz_Pg=w868-h651-no


And after:

FExByFkXKPmZ8jVEUKzwb9tCB5g1_Knr9zFKLqA_uP3qfAEYvN-wpDOIk3ZOXAgOuFil6VGjhs4_GDh_IaRUfuES6U4SEjHZaMzv-91H2oKgpGg8BLXcCUaVg7l66VXZdPZNdMlJC45g4a12mfft1wAa9r4YOrrxPcZA0RYMMsplfmKqWerAeH8Lk_ipmTs3dQDbmhJt054Wsr-Ka37Bjq_L7FiXDGTNVDiYK-XUwwnZSkJoK2Kg8BH_b5ZUE1KayGbOUdJq0ryrV4GEvBX0LoJuv2nw_rXoP286SXwABIt7c1mfLNKF8SYzHqJHH7MGJnpbENwBwhOsYzsPw9YGx1q86KZnmSzqXiX-r7EXU5Q8rLESqen8lyVz1HyhHMzqWAsmFcjwgr7tODC4NneqshIFrdDrovChr45B5V2LFwmsohFv9GXRaoGfOkblQCkEZjDyfoQBw6ebddJbdj-5YyzEmNv1sjsRTQMMhKqB6XpMXcfWbXE-WeJVvNBgAvM88WLF2MvCbibYfVohGRNBNCSYHYGz5I2dBYevktQrQ_Bw1CFxidtS52OfNxQJn_pwl1QfElCrIDQTYOTDsNB3dgQ3HnlfVTsxcuoH9nronRqZksNhoK3bzGkRfgG2mvQ1pxx0qKzAuHwyJH8a3XLgNUmp1jeD18fTaAzA867Krw=w489-h651-no


This is, unfortunately, indicative of the abuse that the piano was dealt--the lacquer coating was badly damaged from high humidity, wherever it was stored. It will definitely need to be refinished in the entirety, if only to fix the slip-shod job of the previous person who restored it, and got lacquer on parts that should never have had them. I'm going to generously(?) assume that whoever electrified the piano was responsible, and was proud enough to put their name on it, but not proud enough to make it look nice:

ucikONfum95VoL6bBahoby787bvhXAbvR3yjUlUHL8PjV-D9_m2jNqChxCh-nzPPMjMugJ23y_rwR9dt0-Bf0GYb9ob5sBy8plskxjs39Jcnwz4XpknGioDb-vdO9zClhdv9za7aGsLseF5zIdTtNCRDHMbtvzZfnCEN8H0uThxASDiE_ku2-6Yk_4dfkGIXzUH2o1zUosLj--FAb3xU-N2hEE9-FNpRwPovlbloonoJmT6gHlSac9MF-UnnyM5MptVbTUYzL2wFVx1_oW8p0INESRL0EK30Pslhwka9I92f8dNPtJ1J-rm3I4nAehyl2pKFzpLU6MwvE21olVxLd4hsYAz3zJvKoPcc7d6JsUH54N6lHVFs4pIth5lss1ufOVNGeCZ3KgdLPDlrXQ6S4bB7OufH5i0b_HTZaxVj5oF61Iert8O2u_5cTYuIQt9bBGwO6cZ2GpiSm8b3HwTl1XmxJSlfTnni3X-N5sEmBjgfA76jyCt8R4DZ8PT8Fg5XDIiwy9E13M_GGdzqgmUNj0XzAisFFKk3qEdH7x6wt3fGOhzd-QS4DrPYYEz8JmTWr1uC2x9avy0ZDYHT-aNMVuYNl4T7byIjYDqrJaRJoL6qkJjDXst6_O-Rz-pqV_AfUmKSa3jrahszudbKyWsyFo7pjlOdxJmdBUKZnFT8Bw=w868-h651-no

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Only partially visible above, is the folded armature (above the pedals) that is attached to the vacuum bellows to either side, and the main reservoir, above, that supplies the manual (or should it be pedal?) vacuum pressure to run the player mechanism. If you knew what you were looking for, you could see where the rubber coating has flaked away from the reservoir, making the player inoperative.

The actual mechanism is run by a vacuum powered motor, but probably unlike anything you've ever seen;

zq7rrB3biUmsA3fJCePhhwc2apnDMSu53Y5DfzPtcZY5Tt1PqKEc5Xh8jrCazNp43W6PvlP1VrgRyRrB1Lfot4bI-4gcUpNzReofNTtbgfRl1GYAm93h54azFTieLxRyvTIGWzgyd14P2ZjaHjG0hH7aTbShoSX_Za5nw7F5-2EfyF1PIf06ZxLdrvNdSr2zJKsNPxD8wfySRrcbtkO235cgoWNidA2sJ68r9bMMu-CGPNrDt1wAs_svePuE94hAoVZgBTkpdOyzzM0wZPE2VIlHwTv6EnZz5UegqtsfRm0cYD-_xnTEyJZMNpZfuJLAsIsaeDadLk1caXdXK57FTHxBlmnV86r8zvAfT_J5B_B0nZXJQUXR7a0LIXRGaPISwxejp-Nz64FxwgbErl5-Slg-sVFeBZodZv2le41zLxLqsZIc9ZBXHV6r2K2ux08Kpv_zDkyMY46Lu1Y4eM7SoFDHp0KUn0Ul5rRPccYS0Bpu7QLTkRw_htVNSSDge3iei4sW00AXr5TCRdy1vePSvla8blL3z-0jddw0nNwqVCFDj0uQy4DtFyiv96PLZC3WwnkQ3_q69DL-FTSnErC3dvaf2YKyXbvjDVfAF0IvzuAS3LYOZE2UMqLOyidlTqcEyYiP0S4YFKmypc4Og_6QJAX6XyY1tseok9NLXElwuQ=w868-h651-no


Negative pressure enters from the right hand side, and collapses the bellows hidden behind, which, in turn, pull on the camshaft, visible above. As the sliding plates in front clear the hole, the pressure in the bellows returns positive, and it is reset, ready for the next cycle.

A view from the top of the mechanism:

JapLv7U3fI689bjXt8ANTv_B9PxJq39DjLM65aSkU6OfV0JM17jVnW29oUZPOGuZW6ebEXwsh8c8DKv3yb--5arhc_gPe8mpPRZetiJPO3etE6oPere3UeSTt-ysGVsxXXyk5TpczZzd3RqGS9kd2_iCaKNSqHkfPI8tw_oqrPpzluBeZozSqcTjzQGUm45WDWuTql3hyXD6OBO2oZie-UzZJJbBNwcM3doHI4nhkWoPs_sOglDA7o_FRf8d5cEUFwe_og_ZupeYbTU5XSMP77X3Zws1HIbe2uAdL567RYPo0lOmaHsqc_bkbAFn5pXSJiepKyloffnKIwjCUUi_p_udRn3v9_LlcW82d6VALaYbFjRMF3vwo1cxbbsN3kVY99YMXkekXZRzDdEB9V9Fqli42D0IhlmVXaDoAnU1Wjj_RC0QdgffSf781NwWTnNpXQbxu08i_0RpFSu84d1-JlbkWvZh8AmJ3Z4RYpr8CMdLXj0nXnumsUUOFUVK1SRNqewHpSgY6ELnrs7niPemvqPa0QmbKc6s0T5sRvBeXHnjbTnJP7h5jLOH8DzCLYQPmOmtFGU_dtiLnK91MgSHXr-jpnHFSwvKWbyCE1A-8ykE7Mksx6GIcHwUOmtAVcfRu2Skt2RoLvutHmFdwdmb26Cxi85GjVlvGAkiiDvD2Q=w868-h651-no


The first order of business, other than cleaning the dust I could reach, was to remove the player mechanism, to access the piano's action. The first casualty-due-to-old-age was the hose that connected the vacuum reservoir to the motor, which split with no provocation:

SO9PnG1TYxqAW1-OaEp7Z4UQg4SmyWKAp7T6VIRoxi_nVMz9UyuOMDoDPz4WMrwT3qbDpB6QYYzFHYCFQ0hOPHnrt0mOJ0svwC04aXbZtT3YrQRF9poOq_RjbEpR8JcLKmJ7XUdeR4veBXzdVyVICHQW9rVVwVfYtN5AthWY15UdNQvVmSqXBaAh8JlZyJodOtjg6APjDvqg3tl7NsMRYMG-ijTEOTDfdrE7ZFD0wO5FcdteoQ1orwRviSwgx2jz6UEnDHc__6sABYFE2fTR1ZEDINu8PvGpfMttcX7hLLdrIWpO0j9nNOdhZwrg-f32HpVDy4y4tLXsX3UacdkETbRucHNzDRgClGkAUSJFSTfDCpv5LPV0beKU-gedhWuOuJzH8Wjj6YNxddbdc-79nwmH6I6NK73hCf7Jf6YS7nvYTpEtZSzufQWzi8YHMnEp9Oh1EPyoKf7ZtZ0gLTMZTLB3oabSjuAgwhPt6NcB7BAOJJ97yO-xNcsMWV9-JviOd4kOfcWUo3vk60Phgs0M-iBlNrjsDtDkRiuvd27t-IBkEoPQFgnAs0ZVLgPyNvcEFRRM7YmIRGj7q3XEm1Doa8cYCtxlBwzCk68DGDwqTfHfXwUU_VBp4iCvdriOD2ZO7-wVkCFxODGZ9sInEY12RmMaRWVbzYC2R9fOh6kveg=w868-h651-no


Once disconnected, the player could be removed, in two sections, the motor and roll frame (background), and the actual player action, foreground:

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ZQC01I2wJRNj0vfx_9xF01pLzzAQhU6eVzKF5aL09jpsPnt9pjCqM5rP-wDoKD7LgZA3_XduAQftVfMouazp2tL1fHqyu6XAOZ-pLMGP2_XRCJm8kn_p7RFuTKXvHYcQ8Q6nBPR6hNtb8CHH0cDkgwyANZebhVN7AakM-_3fHTLo8SfjWHzO7XNIrCFFC4H4SiQPffaY7Fv3Ce9kr5fv4oPK7ggLUcvdR8km6iGdwSubAs8ZeC5FiurbghfJAKdKYebgQsGy4Bhd9dlXowqxL7ZGtlbE-DqE04_Bf6WAkCVYKUFihocvQ_8RUKqlPiERFAAYd1obbZ3YirX8v0uMN-b2Hf-_841Az0R-09DCYyfGsD0Aj4MtQ7TVivZ2y4KusmP3imjCPfqQ6-aY4pQwpLGjxw_Nnvkbi55ZJqWc9FrXkokuwHjRc7zbOtuwy1X70L2dIA1XBKgwCLUKN_ArNx0YATS2whb0HmY8NOE2XRP_iOjlIhcpUVYfjuvpL4nYS6A3e8eRcXYyrUzyCuWQRCsBb4QuF-pHhlBOpU8GA1HBzRrzbiuwkr2YFx6vkQFPgi5HoIIdQsZD3oYSTX6hB090G_-MMIhQk9e-sIeWphHrWAQnH8612wyEL1dS7pYAwLz6L7ac1aOtmc0On-Cpbn4WrYQqFxPolsxElHj7uw=w868-h651-no

(heart attack central)​

You will see, that unlike the Milton, with its plethora of small diameter tubing/nightmare inducing disassembly process, there is a series of holes along the top of the player action (bottom most portion, in the picture), through which vacuum travels to the individual action bellows. It is really a magnificent feat of woodworking, when you think about it. More will definitely need to happen here, as I test the action itself for proper operation before reinstalling it.

With the player mechanism finally out of the way, the piano action could finally be accessed:

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The news is...not good.

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The wood is sound, all around, but almost all of the felt is either moth-bitten to the point of uselessness, or hard as a rock (and horribly compressed). The buckskin portions of the action are, likewise, pretty well shot. Many of the bridle straps are broken. The hammers are largely unsalvageable, and will need to be replaced (but in the meantime, will be filed/pressed to attempt to return some semblance of usability to the piano. At least the strings are in good shape (at least until I try to tune it!).

As a bonus for those who read all the way to the end, here's an action shot of the motor running off of a handheld vacuum (turn the volume off!):

 

clarkenstein

JORBA Board Member/Chapter Leader
JORBA.ORG
Dude - right up my alley! I picked up a piano and learned a ton about them... especially how they age. We have a used Baldwin console upright (not a spinet). Really similar to what I grew up with.

It does need a tune... I have always wanted to learn how to tune a piano. In music school I would watch the tuners move from practice room to practice room. Honestly, they looked like lunatics at the time, but I sorta get it.

It's costly to restore like this?
 

rottin'

Well-Known Member
Staff member
Team MTBNJ Halter's
Hey, I know your name [redacted] lol...man, that motor powered by the vacuum looks like a car motor driving the camshafts...that's crazy! Looking forward to the rebuild...really enjoyed the detailed(and extremely educational) posts of the last! Hope you're healing up!
 

Karate Monkey

Well-Known Member
Dude - right up my alley! I picked up a piano and learned a ton about them... especially how they age. We have a used Baldwin console upright (not a spinet). Really similar to what I grew up with.

It does need a tune... I have always wanted to learn how to tune a piano. In music school I would watch the tuners move from practice room to practice room. Honestly, they looked like lunatics at the time, but I sorta get it.

It's costly to restore like this?

Tuning isn't particularly difficult, but you will inevitably break strings, either from not turning the right pin, or from rust/age. The biggest initial investment is time, especially if you are teaching yourself to tune aurally, rather than by machine. A cheap tuning hammer is $20, or so. Stop by the house, and I'll give you one to start with. Most of the techs that I know are more than happy to let you watch while they work, too.

The worst part are the strings, dampers, and hammers...a decent set of the three will run around $800-1000, and replacing them is in the multiple work-day terriotory. Factory techs can get the strings in at a rate of about 1 every 2-3 minutes, but there isn't anything in the way when they do it (and they use power tools), and they don't need to remove the old ones, which takes around 1 hour. "Chipping" them up to pitch is another hour, or so, and then actually tuning them. Tuning pins can be quite expensive, but they are usually salvageable, if doing a full rebuild. The little bits you'll need (several cloth sizes, felt, punchings, buckskin, etc) usually run around $100-200. Final touches (transfer decals for the soundboard/case, supplies for restoring the case) are going to run another $100, or so. You can save a ton of money rebuilding a piano if you focus more on using what is in the piano, but that falls more under regulation, than rebuilding.

The tools you need are a separate expense, and many of the tools for the action have no traditional analogues, so you need to purchase them from a piano supply company (there are only 4-5 manufacturers that actually makes these things...). A basic regulation kit usually starts around $125, but a master's kit is well in excess of $500, and doesn't even include some of the more repair-oriented tools. There are a plethora of woodworking tools you would need in a shop, but many parts can be duplicated by a shop, in lieu of you doing it yourself (bridges, pinblocks, etc...). A setup for hide glue, which is necessary for a good rebuild/repair is going to set you back another $100-150 for a temperature stable pot (hide glue will 'cook' and become useless if it heats up too much). The good news is that glue crystals themselves are pretty cheap, even if you are buying the good stuff.

Only particularly uncommon pianos/old pianos are really worth fixing...anything else is like the proverbial boat (hole) in the water. The break point seems to be around $4-5000 for a new piano, where rebuilding it every 10-15 years (as a home user, not a hall) is a reasonable expense versus a new instrument. I say old, by the way, because they tend to be better made, with tighter tolerances. Usually, anything under a full-size upright/grand of any size isn't worth restoring, unless you are doing it for practice.

Why can't I move a piano on a flatbed?

Whatever floats your boat. I've moved them in a pickup, before...just sucks getting it in the bed.
 

gtluke

The Moped
dope. my buddy has an ancient stienway player piano. he had the piano part restored to playing condition but he said that to get the player part to work it was approximately 19 billion dollars. or close to that. I think it had a vacuum bellows for every single key or something? nuts.
anyway, anyone that knows how to read sheet music is an alien.
 

rick81721

Lothar
Tuning isn't particularly difficult, but you will inevitably break strings, either from not turning the right pin, or from rust/age. The biggest initial investment is time, especially if you are teaching yourself to tune aurally, rather than by machine. A cheap tuning hammer is $20, or so. Stop by the house, and I'll give you one to start with. Most of the techs that I know are more than happy to let you watch while they work, too.

The worst part are the strings, dampers, and hammers...a decent set of the three will run around $800-1000, and replacing them is in the multiple work-day terriotory. Factory techs can get the strings in at a rate of about 1 every 2-3 minutes, but there isn't anything in the way when they do it (and they use power tools), and they don't need to remove the old ones, which takes around 1 hour. "Chipping" them up to pitch is another hour, or so, and then actually tuning them. Tuning pins can be quite expensive, but they are usually salvageable, if doing a full rebuild. The little bits you'll need (several cloth sizes, felt, punchings, buckskin, etc) usually run around $100-200. Final touches (transfer decals for the soundboard/case, supplies for restoring the case) are going to run another $100, or so. You can save a ton of money rebuilding a piano if you focus more on using what is in the piano, but that falls more under regulation, than rebuilding.

The tools you need are a separate expense, and many of the tools for the action have no traditional analogues, so you need to purchase them from a piano supply company (there are only 4-5 manufacturers that actually makes these things...). A basic regulation kit usually starts around $125, but a master's kit is well in excess of $500, and doesn't even include some of the more repair-oriented tools. There are a plethora of woodworking tools you would need in a shop, but many parts can be duplicated by a shop, in lieu of you doing it yourself (bridges, pinblocks, etc...). A setup for hide glue, which is necessary for a good rebuild/repair is going to set you back another $100-150 for a temperature stable pot (hide glue will 'cook' and become useless if it heats up too much). The good news is that glue crystals themselves are pretty cheap, even if you are buying the good stuff.

Only particularly uncommon pianos/old pianos are really worth fixing...anything else is like the proverbial boat (hole) in the water. The break point seems to be around $4-5000 for a new piano, where rebuilding it every 10-15 years (as a home user, not a hall) is a reasonable expense versus a new instrument. I say old, by the way, because they tend to be better made, with tighter tolerances. Usually, anything under a full-size upright/grand of any size isn't worth restoring, unless you are doing it for practice.



Whatever floats your boat. I've moved them in a pickup, before...just sucks getting it in the bed.

The piano I learned to play on is still at my brothers house in pennsy. 80+ year old upright, had great tone in its day, I've often wondered whether it was worth restoring.

I can play piano from sheet music but never learned to do so on the guitar
 

Karate Monkey

Well-Known Member
The piano I learned to play on is still at my brothers house in pennsy. 80+ year old upright, had great tone in its day, I've often wondered whether it was worth restoring.

I can play piano from sheet music but never learned to do so on the guitar

Whether or not there is any truth to it, it is often said that pre-[world] war [2] pianos sound better due to differences in the composition of modern iron-alloys (which is what a good 3-400 pounds of the piano is made of).

I personally think more of it has to do with the person involved with building the instrument, but there always seems to be an allure towards older things. I know I'm guilty, anyway.
 

rottin'

Well-Known Member
Staff member
Team MTBNJ Halter's
[QUOTE="I know less than nothing about the subject but it's got my attention.... it's like having our own episode of "How It's Made" playing out right in front of us.
:thumbsup:[/QUOTE]
I'm thinking more along the lines of "Ultimate Restorations" lol
 

Karate Monkey

Well-Known Member
A short update:

Since I can only work in relatively short spurts (cramping hand, back, etc), this process will probably take a few days.

VZvt0YyEWan0TGdDEQsSQ_3e5aijNW6Ng7giecH_e9u3KK18g2842P72MJj1NyVEBF5baRA5297gHiqGVtc6azfr5wKBz6OHXjM2TcfkrZ86yXqif7jqftHMMCJ1xRrF6EuRGlSo1mU4tDZOB4boLbTAg85I-HA3LfaUU2ZwdXgxL-ASfID72EMJ5so5LXPyrVltq89JzotglW3AlVhzrw0OQq_kPQSqOEiLFNQ3fB2K3IkFHX9LcEMkfcoduwfLBGwDrU8P8m6OQG85aQ3PtUk0_nwmuzL_VEspiMQhvUbmMmkVt3MPj9QElOPeQppamnsAtN4kaeHflCGyyYAcQ9Q1j_2oTNDSXSY38owzOJ71QJbvjekpvnYPJEmS1-IpavyG4ljaI-y4v0ZYpdsOHEoECE-ebzy_UEVeLB8ldEF1aJY1YQJqWcCnKVEJ3QbawbLS3PFUwGFjQsSsNqXKRFkcjXn5mVc46cwzVsHbxYtMIMAPJvOO2GOcQGndER7xIRkXn9X6bklHR-z9Up9eYUkV_SM7Za0zi_wU6Y4ZNbTXEA550yVHurNl22NqUvnEuvYsN25uZbnY_XK_QKrXUNgsmwyj5F4FLOAXWvW5nKmyxpF_sxtjL6G3pNHq3y-fJg6CtuaIOpjPn1gfF8P4ttpsVfbAolyd_npIYPsZyw=w868-h651-no


The keys, clearly, are quite dirty (that is, the key tops--the stick itself, the body, is ignored unless it is visible when playing the piano). The sharps have already had a quick wipe-down, but will need a more thorough cleaning, as well.

Here is a progress shot of the work:

drPKiNLWJd-ey72dZ-4h8AWAeQ_F_v5KMiWiiok6vsj__y9v9T0XfwT37PB9tsaL39m2SBJ3-ebsd2wgd8xiZe7cQEbVci3OPrtwV8c4k93QfCMHcOOh8bH9GaTQU57AibJCBT_8J5WECrCvZ_o20FHMNkNj_ZhBcSfwHWKHGu9YUC7jUrVrie4qPYO7-6In4uRhTfpKJHpEVBEoQCstGrlJ1Nxh8Be_xj_RS3e5c7HPxOKZrMyciC-E9_7p8hTrUqiuEcGfJ8fEJ1IsW09F0Vm6QTRum02zTxWDVs6gR4NSH5p3Tjy7pSSWfToJeMHdkAMyqCXRLLRHEONEafEGXiQd1RRi6F-OoRXfsImCxZ95ajxY0K_rNfWyemuDHS_HwHdStUZxWSQmeJhybsOtujcgeb1kIb5BkHk4avqp2P8vg1UbZuhLbgQAJs1fpVbJuCp0WyTsHxYu0kDWX8Tb207yiLUi-Q28NWQNZTpnza1xTUQxqoWcehQVxI40MqtTSBX9bISIJ1O7QvpV9WR5JjxAEcyaOCd2pNfMTkhYVUHnLY4sL_JpxpszbST3hwOxzPDzzXmS3GGJdRqcwgCZXkpUJATZMIRzRFJMPixxe0FVD2wZs73ySt78JSMBxJvyK7cvXSXOlPy2TgnOAnjw2e6XmGUe7WUABz5V7DGPCQ=w868-h651-no


Half of the white keys have been initially cleaned here--it is hard work. A mixture of alcohol and talcum powder is vigorously rubbed into the keytop using a piece of felt to remove any built up dirt/oil. This only applies to cow-bone/ivory keys, which you can tell by a combination of color, grain, and a subtle separation between the tail and head of the top (visible on some of the keys as a dark, sharp line). Plastic keys would be cleaned using a mild solution of vinegar/other cleaning substance, no particular special care required. The one dirty key in the bunch is missing a portion of the keytop, which will be replaced with a synthetic ivory top, made from a resin casting.
 

qclabrat

Well-Known Member
A short update:

Since I can only work in relatively short spurts (cramping hand, back, etc), this process will probably take a few days.

VZvt0YyEWan0TGdDEQsSQ_3e5aijNW6Ng7giecH_e9u3KK18g2842P72MJj1NyVEBF5baRA5297gHiqGVtc6azfr5wKBz6OHXjM2TcfkrZ86yXqif7jqftHMMCJ1xRrF6EuRGlSo1mU4tDZOB4boLbTAg85I-HA3LfaUU2ZwdXgxL-ASfID72EMJ5so5LXPyrVltq89JzotglW3AlVhzrw0OQq_kPQSqOEiLFNQ3fB2K3IkFHX9LcEMkfcoduwfLBGwDrU8P8m6OQG85aQ3PtUk0_nwmuzL_VEspiMQhvUbmMmkVt3MPj9QElOPeQppamnsAtN4kaeHflCGyyYAcQ9Q1j_2oTNDSXSY38owzOJ71QJbvjekpvnYPJEmS1-IpavyG4ljaI-y4v0ZYpdsOHEoECE-ebzy_UEVeLB8ldEF1aJY1YQJqWcCnKVEJ3QbawbLS3PFUwGFjQsSsNqXKRFkcjXn5mVc46cwzVsHbxYtMIMAPJvOO2GOcQGndER7xIRkXn9X6bklHR-z9Up9eYUkV_SM7Za0zi_wU6Y4ZNbTXEA550yVHurNl22NqUvnEuvYsN25uZbnY_XK_QKrXUNgsmwyj5F4FLOAXWvW5nKmyxpF_sxtjL6G3pNHq3y-fJg6CtuaIOpjPn1gfF8P4ttpsVfbAolyd_npIYPsZyw=w868-h651-no


The keys, clearly, are quite dirty (that is, the key tops--the stick itself, the body, is ignored unless it is visible when playing the piano). The sharps have already had a quick wipe-down, but will need a more thorough cleaning, as well.

Here is a progress shot of the work:

drPKiNLWJd-ey72dZ-4h8AWAeQ_F_v5KMiWiiok6vsj__y9v9T0XfwT37PB9tsaL39m2SBJ3-ebsd2wgd8xiZe7cQEbVci3OPrtwV8c4k93QfCMHcOOh8bH9GaTQU57AibJCBT_8J5WECrCvZ_o20FHMNkNj_ZhBcSfwHWKHGu9YUC7jUrVrie4qPYO7-6In4uRhTfpKJHpEVBEoQCstGrlJ1Nxh8Be_xj_RS3e5c7HPxOKZrMyciC-E9_7p8hTrUqiuEcGfJ8fEJ1IsW09F0Vm6QTRum02zTxWDVs6gR4NSH5p3Tjy7pSSWfToJeMHdkAMyqCXRLLRHEONEafEGXiQd1RRi6F-OoRXfsImCxZ95ajxY0K_rNfWyemuDHS_HwHdStUZxWSQmeJhybsOtujcgeb1kIb5BkHk4avqp2P8vg1UbZuhLbgQAJs1fpVbJuCp0WyTsHxYu0kDWX8Tb207yiLUi-Q28NWQNZTpnza1xTUQxqoWcehQVxI40MqtTSBX9bISIJ1O7QvpV9WR5JjxAEcyaOCd2pNfMTkhYVUHnLY4sL_JpxpszbST3hwOxzPDzzXmS3GGJdRqcwgCZXkpUJATZMIRzRFJMPixxe0FVD2wZs73ySt78JSMBxJvyK7cvXSXOlPy2TgnOAnjw2e6XmGUe7WUABz5V7DGPCQ=w868-h651-no


Half of the white keys have been initially cleaned here--it is hard work. A mixture of alcohol and talcum powder is vigorously rubbed into the keytop using a piece of felt to remove any built up dirt/oil. This only applies to cow-bone/ivory keys, which you can tell by a combination of color, grain, and a subtle separation between the tail and head of the top (visible on some of the keys as a dark, sharp line). Plastic keys would be cleaned using a mild solution of vinegar/other cleaning substance, no particular special care required. The one dirty key in the bunch is missing a portion of the keytop, which will be replaced with a synthetic ivory top, made from a resin casting.

I'm always amazed by your eye for detail, how long (hours) would you estimate this restoration will take, assuming parts are readily available.
 

Karate Monkey

Well-Known Member
I'm always amazed by your eye for detail, how long (hours) would you estimate this restoration will take, assuming parts are readily available.

Currently, I'm limited more by my injury than anything else, but I figure (if everything went perfectly):

-5-8 hours re-finishing the case...and probably another 5-8 hours stripping the old finish/repairing any knicks/damage (I'm looking at you, NUNN...)
-2-3 hours (and people) for removing/refinishing the plate (the big cast iron bit that holds the string tension). This part usually require the use of an engine lift/silk lifting straps. It must be stripped, and re-lacquered with gold paint. The lettering on the plate is traditionally done using black lacquer/enamel. Anyone who's worked with lacquer before knows how much of a PITA that is, so I will probably be using an enamel to letter with.
-4-5 hours or so to re-string the piano (plus a couple to remove them in the first place).
-12-20+ hours for the action, removing felt/buckskin and replacing it with new. This will probably take the lions share of time. Just like a vintage bike, you always find something else that is wrong when you get into it.
-2-??? hours for the keys, cleaning, etc. There are several tops that are separating, and must be carefully removed to be re-adhered. They felt bushings on the keys actually look fairly decent, surprisingly, and wont need immediate replacing.
-2-3 hours boring new hammers for the action, and gluing them in place (unless I can find them already bored at the correct angle, which is a crapshoot). Bulk hammer drilling guides are ridiculously expensive, so it's pretty slow work.
-2-4 hours regulating the [now refurbished] action. This will have to be repeated after a few weeks, as the felt compacts slightly.
-3-??? hours for evaluating/repairing the player. So far, I know that the roll frame/motor are functional, but the condition of the player action is unknown (but looks good). I know that the large bellows (foot pumps, reservoir) will likely need to be repaired/replaced.
-lots of hours to regulate the player action, which must be done by installing/removing the action. It's glorified guess work, is what I'm saying.
-1 hour for the first proper tuning. Will also need to be repeated several times, while the piano settles in.

This is aside from the things that I won't have control over; once the piano is totally disassembled, all the small metal bits that were nickle plated (screws, bolts, pins/slides, pneumatic springs, etc) will have to go out to be re-done...there is very little hardware in a piano that is 'normal', so replacements are problematic. I'll probably locate a firearms shop that does bluing to re-coat the tuning pins, if they are still usable...it's miserable work, and worth paying for, given the large quantity of them that need to be re-coated. I don't want to be the poor bastard that has to card 250 pins. Depending on what they charge, I may just buy new ones.

A realistic assessment (ie, nothing goes 'right') of the total time to restore it would probably be in the 70-100 hour range. I just have no earthly idea what is going to happen with the player action, but if there are tons of tiny leaks, I could easily spend 15-20 hours repairing/re-regulating the player.
 
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