Are modern geometries this different?

walter

walter

Fourth Party
Ok, I know these bikes are 2 totally different beasts, but can the geometry, sizing, tube lengths be that much different even though the bike is marketed as the same size?
Both bikes pictured are 56's, but the CaadX looks like a friggin monster compared to the Tarmac. Granted the Cannondale is mounted to 32s, but can they really be that much different?
20190216_145406.jpg

I tried to get them as close as possible, but it was getting a little sketchy lol. The top tube difference is what really gets me. What say you?
 
jdog

jdog

Shop: Halter's Cycles
Shop Keep
I'll bite..

A quick search provides this;

C-dale : Stack 59.5 / Reach 39.2
Spec: Stack 56.4 / Reach 39.5

Using these #'s, the reach is really close, but to have the same bar height, you need to overcome the neg 3cm of stack.

Likely this could be achieved with a steeper angle stem and go a cm longer to overcome the loss of reach from the steeper angle.
 
Steve Vai

Steve Vai

Endurance Guy: Tolerates most of us.
This is the same as comparing a downhill bike to an XC bike, 2 completely different bikes. The Caad X has a super high BB and top tube compared to a standard road bike. Even apples to apples, my Giant TCX was like 2 inches taller than my Defy in the same size, yet the TT on the TCX was shorter and the wheelbase was longer.
 
qclabrat

qclabrat

Well-Known Member
I'm so glad we've stopped the suggestions to slap skinny tires to a CX bike and it will be road bike.
 
qclabrat

qclabrat

Well-Known Member
stb222 said:
People make people fast, not bikes. My CX9TJ was shockingly stiff on the road and could totally rip.
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Yeah, but you are already fast and been riding forever
I know so many folks who bought a CX bike because they were told it would be great on the road and dirt/gravel. Sure it works, but how many people are actually riding their dropbar bikes on gravel and dirt, many are still spend the bulk of their time on road. All I meant is that people buy bikes that they believe is meant to doing everything, then get disappointed when it's not particularly good any one type
 
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goldsbar

Well-Known Member
qclabrat said:
Yeah, but you are already fast and been riding forever
I know so many folks who bought a CX bike because they were told it would be great on the road and dirt/gravel. Sure it works, but how many people are actually riding their dropbar bikes on gravel and dirt, many are still spend the bulk of their time on road. All I meant is that people buy bikes that they believe is meant to doing everything, then get disappointed when it's not particularly good any one type
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Ironically, for such a person, a road bike with 28 slicks would be perfect. Sacrifice just a few watts on the road for some modest gravel capability. Also depends what people consider gravel. I haven't done it yet, but have no doubt I can semi-comfortably ride my road bike with 25 slicks on the Columbia Trail when it's in good condition (i.e. not January when they did the old Fat 50 on it).

There's really not much gravel in NJ. Columbia Trail will get boring fast. Two miles are beautiful, the rest is just a flat dirt road. That leads to things like Patriots Path, where you need more of a CX bike...But, of course that's not optimal for the hilly parts so then you're wishing for something more like a rigid MTB, which sucks on the road. Been there, done that.
 
stb222

stb222

Love Drunk
Jerk Squad
qclabrat said:
Yeah, but you are already fast and been riding forever
I know so many folks who bought a CX bike because they were told it would be great on the road and dirt/gravel. Sure it works, but how many people are actually riding their dropbar bikes on gravel and dirt, many are still spend the bulk of their time on road. All I meant is that people buy bikes that they believe is meant to doing everything, then get disappointed when it's not particularly good any one type
Click to expand...
Yeah, but my point is that people were doing “gravel” rides on cross bikes long before the bike category was created, and they did it just fine. The one bike for everything doesn’t exist, there is always a compromise. I did a ride in November, on my EVO with 27’s. Two people where one decked out Open’s and the other on a Synapse. One had 32’s, one had 40’s and one had 50’s. I was out tire’d on two gravel decents, but they were working damn hard on road sections and were absolutely buried on gravel hills, the synapse was the 2nd best equipped over all. So a gravel bike doesn’t do everything well, it does one thing Well and everything else ok. And now they take them on single track and say it is just like a Mtb, yeah, ok.
 
walter

walter

Fourth Party
jimvreeland said:
This is the same as comparing a downhill bike to an XC bike, 2 completely different bikes. The Caad X has a super high BB and top tube compared to a standard road bike. Even apples to apples, my Giant TCX was like 2 inches taller than my Defy in the same size, yet the TT on the TCX was shorter and the wheelbase was longer.
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Didnt even think of the BB height.
 
Dave Taylor

Dave Taylor

Rex kwan Do
stb222 said:
Yeah, but my point is that people were doing “gravel” rides on cross bikes long before the bike category was created, and they did it just fine. The one bike for everything doesn’t exist, there is always a compromise. I did a ride in November, on my EVO with 27’s. Two people where one decked out Open’s and the other on a Synapse. One had 32’s, one had 40’s and one had 50’s. I was out tire’d on two gravel decents, but they were working damn hard on road sections and were absolutely buried on gravel hills, the synapse was the 2nd best equipped over all. So a gravel bike doesn’t do everything well, it does one thing Well and everything else ok. And now they take them on single track and say it is just like a Mtb, yeah, ok.
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This. Same reason I have a road bike, a hardtal mtb and an fs mtb.I train on the road bike, use the hardtail set up as rigid or front suspension with either gears, ss, mtb tires or cx tires. Truthfully I don't even need the cx tires as the aspen mtb tires are so fast I out descended all the cx bikes on the tewksbury area descents. Next thing is trying to do a group road ride on my mtb. I bet I won't work that much harder on the flat stuff.
 
qclabrat

qclabrat

Well-Known Member
goldsbar said:
Ironically, for such a person, a road bike with 28 slicks would be perfect. Sacrifice just a few watts on the road for some modest gravel capability. Also depends what people consider gravel. I haven't done it yet, but have no doubt I can semi-comfortably ride my road bike with 25 slicks on the Columbia Trail when it's in good condition (i.e. not January when they did the old Fat 50 on it).

There's really not much gravel in NJ. Columbia Trail will get boring fast. Two miles are beautiful, the rest is just a flat dirt road. That leads to things like Patriots Path, where you need more of a CX bike...But, of course that's not optimal for the hilly parts so then you're wishing for something more like a rigid MTB, which sucks on the road. Been there, done that.
Click to expand...
I'm hearing it from the other end where they put road tires on a CX bike and high speed descents become sketchy due to the geometry of a bike which wasn't meant to go straight at 40-50 mph.
 
Steve Vai

Steve Vai

Endurance Guy: Tolerates most of us.
qclabrat said:
I'm hearing it from the other end where they put road tires on a CX bike and high speed descents become sketchy due to the geometry of a bike which wasn't meant to go straight at 40-50 mph.
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CX bikes generally ride like ass on the road. The frames are generally very stiff and the geo is designed to pedal corners in grass.
 
stb222

stb222

Love Drunk
Jerk Squad
qclabrat said:
I'm hearing it from the other end where they put road tires on a CX bike and high speed descents become sketchy due to the geometry of a bike which wasn't meant to go straight at 40-50 mph.
Click to expand...
Let’s be honest, how often you going 50? Sure, CX is best on grass, but it can go downhill at 50. Bike selection shouldn’t be based on the 1% of each ride.
 
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